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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #199 of nightly-multilib is complete: Failure [failed Building Images_4] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-multilib/builds/199 | 00:39 | |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #199 of nightly-world is complete: Failure [failed Building Images] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-world/builds/199 | 01:03 | |
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| cerf | hi all | 02:31 |
|---|---|---|
| cerf | Is anybody there? | 02:34 |
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| Crofton | patient guy | 02:44 |
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| britzp | Hi all, to which mailing list do I submit a patch to /build/tmp/work/armv7a-vfp-neon-poky-linux-gnueabi/libdce/git-r1/git/wayland-drm-protocol.c, anyone knows? | 05:10 |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #167 of nightly is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly/builds/167 | 06:09 | |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #205 of poky-tiny is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/poky-tiny/builds/205 | 06:33 | |
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| mckoan | good morning | 07:24 |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #202 of nightly-non-gpl3 is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-non-gpl3/builds/202 | 07:34 | |
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| fenrig | Hi where can I find documentation on how to get X11 working properly when building with yocto :) | 09:03 |
| rburton_ | fenrig: just works for me, what's the problem? | 09:03 |
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| Stygia | (cross-posted from #oe) Hey, I have a question. I am trying to bitbake a package, and this package depends on another package. However... it seems as if the second package gets compiled for x86_64, while the project as a whole is ARM. This causes the first (dependent) package to fail, with an error that it ELFCLASS32 is (obviously) not right for building an ARM program. This is the error output: http://pastebin.com/727V2g9r | 09:04 |
| fenrig | rburton_: Well i'm at the moment making a image based on core-image-minimal with qtbase, so I assume (yes I know this isn't that good) that X will be included. But I just have to include X to have it working properly, no need to configure anything? | 09:04 |
| Stygia | It seems -c cleanall on perl or the original package does not help either. Anyone have any suggestions | 09:04 |
| rburton_ | fenrig: probably best to start with something a bit bigger than minimal, there's a base x11 image you can start from | 09:05 |
| eren | good morning all | 09:05 |
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| fenrig | rburton_: ah where can I find this image? | 09:06 |
| rburton_ | fenrig: cunningly called core-image-x11 ;) | 09:07 |
| fenrig | rburton_: Very cunning indeed, thx for your help. Also do you have any documentation advice, I'm having a hard time with finding certain information | 09:08 |
| rburton_ | fenrig: only the documentation on www.yoctoproject.org | 09:09 |
| rburton_ | unless you have something more specific | 09:09 |
| fenrig | Well yes, I want to know more about existing images and how they work, especially the core-image-x11 | 09:10 |
| eren | fenrig: "how they work" is a bit general term | 09:10 |
| rburton_ | you can get a list of images by doing something along the lines of ls */recipes/*/images/*.bb | 09:11 |
| eren | are you asking how OpenEmbedded works, or? | 09:11 |
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| fenrig | no not really, I'm trying to find that out while I'm trying to get things working. At the moment I'm trying to include Qt in my image. | 09:12 |
| rburton_ | and looking at core-image-x11 you'll see that adding the x11-base image feature gives you a base X stack | 09:12 |
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| eren | huge netsplit :/ | 09:14 |
| fenrig | also about the rpm's that I generate (using yocto distro) can I manually install them later? And is there a package manager included for that or do I have to add one to the image? | 09:14 |
| rburton_ | fenrig: yes | 09:14 |
| rburton_ | if the image features contains package-management, you get your chosen package manager | 09:14 |
| eren | shouldn't he enable 'package-management' in distro features to get the package manager in the image? | 09:15 |
| eren | ah, image features, sorry | 09:15 |
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| fenrig | okay cool :D | 09:15 |
| fenrig | thx guys you helped me out a lot. | 09:15 |
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| rburton_ | fenrig: http://www.yoctoproject.org/docs/current/dev-manual/dev-manual.html contains all these answers | 09:17 |
| fenrig | rburton_: I have it open already, but I did not read everything already. | 09:18 |
| fenrig | but obviously I should. | 09:18 |
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| fenrig | ohyeah, extracting the rootfs.tar.gz to a sd kaart, is there a good tool for this or just use tar? | 09:22 |
| rburton_ | the rpi layer has tools to automate all that, some other layers seem to expect people to write their own script | 09:23 |
| fenrig | i'm using the beaglebone black here :p | 09:23 |
| rburton_ | afaik, meta-ti doesn't have any tooling to create sd card images for you | 09:24 |
| rburton_ | but i don't have anything that uses meta-ti, so don't expect me to know :) | 09:24 |
| fenrig | i'm actually using meta-beagleboard instead of meta-ti :) | 09:26 |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #200 of nightly-multilib is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-multilib/builds/200 | 09:34 | |
| ant_work | fenrig: nice to hear you survived to the first impact | 09:40 |
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| fenrig | ant_work: Yes I'm quite suprised actually. I'm still a bachelor student that just passed his second year :D | 09:47 |
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| ant_work | there are oddities in that layer, though. Probably purposedly done. | 09:50 |
| pev | Can any of you guys give a spot of advice over setting up a .bbappend to modify busybox? | 09:53 |
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| pev | I want to change few vars set up by a lower layers defconfig. From what I can see you have to implement do_prepare_config_append() - the only example I can find just uses sed to replace strings, so is that it? Should I just replace instances of "# CONFIG_WIBBLE is not set" with "CONFIG_WIBBLE=y"? Is there a more intelligent way that you can go about it? | 09:55 |
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| bluelightning | pev: which version of the build system are you using? | 10:05 |
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| bluelightning | pev: if it's 1.4 (dylan) or above you can use config fragments with busybox, i.e. you just add the options you want to enable to a .cfg file and then add that to SRC_URI in a bbappend in your layer | 10:07 |
| Stygia | Does anyone here have any idea why a package I'm building for ARM would try to include an .so file that doesn't match its architecture? I've clean everything, and yet, it fails for including the wrong files. Any suggestions here? | 10:09 |
| rburton_ | Stygia: because the makefile is using the wrong compilier? is the .so compiled for your build host? | 10:10 |
| Stygia | rburton_, The .so is for my target host, for some reason, I recipe I wrote tries to include this file, from an x86_64 dir. As in, another package (in x86_64) tries to depend on the correct .so file, and it fails due to ELFCLASS error. | 10:11 |
| Stygia | http://pastebin.com/727V2g9r | 10:11 |
| Stygia | rburton_, This is the output. | 10:11 |
| Stygia | rburton_, From do_compile I believe, this is what bitbake with no -D's showed. | 10:12 |
| rburton_ | Stygia: run file on the .so it moans about, and compare it to a known-good one. | 10:13 |
| rburton_ | Stygia: that will tell you exactly what sort of binary it is | 10:13 |
| rburton_ | oh | 10:13 |
| rburton_ | native perl is loading non-native perl modules | 10:13 |
| rburton_ | that's the problem | 10:13 |
| Stygia | rburton_, Hmm? Well I have added tons of perl recipes. | 10:14 |
| Stygia | rburton_, But, they are being 'loaded' as RDEPENDS for my primary script (that depends on all the CPAN modules). | 10:14 |
| rburton_ | you're running perl, so obviously that's perl-native | 10:14 |
| Stygia | rburton_, How can I prevent native perl from doing it that then? | 10:14 |
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| * rburton_ shrugs | 10:14 | |
| Stygia | rburton_, I'm not completely certain I understand. | 10:14 |
| rburton_ | are you messing with the perl path in your recipe? | 10:14 |
| Stygia | I've just created yet another cpan-related recipe. | 10:14 |
| Stygia | rburton_, No. | 10:15 |
| rburton_ | try inherit perlnative | 10:15 |
| Stygia | rburton_, http://pastebin.com/AccF9C06 | 10:15 |
| rburton_ | actually you must be doing that | 10:15 |
| Stygia | rburton_, This is all of it. | 10:15 |
| Stygia | rburton_, Uh sorry: bhttp://pastebin.com/AccF9C06 | 10:15 |
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| rburton_ | i'm fairly ignorant about how the perl classes work | 10:16 |
| Stygia | rburton_, That's how I feel about the entire BB system... | 10:17 |
| rburton_ | for some reason your native perl binary is using target lib directory | 10:17 |
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| Stygia | rburton_, Adding inherit perlnative above inherit cpan didn't help. | 10:18 |
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| Stygia | rburton_, I suppose I will try "manually" installing this package, then... as it is possible the cpan modules are failing. | 10:18 |
| rburton_ | Stygia: its likely a bug in the upstream build system | 10:21 |
| Stygia | rburton_, Quite possible I suppose. | 10:21 |
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| pev | bluelightning: I'm not sure of the exact version - it's based on 1.4 but with a load of new upstream stuff from GIT (someone gave me the distro) | 10:33 |
| bluelightning | pev: ok, then you'll very likely have config fragment support in your busybox recipe, so I'd suggest trying that | 10:34 |
| pev | bluelightning: Is there an example of that somewhere obvious I can see? I assume that only works for enabling extra CONFIG_ vars and that you can't disable ones that are already enabled? | 10:34 |
| bluelightning | pev: if you add "CONFIG_XYZ_ | 10:35 |
| bluelightning | er | 10:35 |
| bluelightning | pev: if you add "# CONFIG_XYZ is not set" to your fragment that should turn off options that the defconfig has enabled | 10:35 |
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| pev | oh, so quite smart then! Is there a standard fragment filename or string inside so I can grep through the tree to see an example of how to set one up? | 10:38 |
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| tf | pev: the fragments all end in .cfg | 10:39 |
| tf | pev: you will probably find some examples in meta-intel | 10:40 |
| pev | Here we go : meta-skeleton/recipes-kernel/linux/linux-yocto-custom.bb | 10:43 |
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| eren | I have a strange behavior while packaging libax25 | 10:43 |
| eren | I inherit autotools | 10:43 |
| eren | it automatically splits packages | 10:43 |
| rburton_ | can you elaborate on that? | 10:43 |
| pev | Given that it's just via SRC_URI does it just assume it's modifying a file named .config in the root? | 10:43 |
| tf | pev, no | 10:44 |
| eren | however, libax25, and libax25-dev are incorrectly split | 10:44 |
| eren | libax25-dev should include only the headers, and libax25 sohuld include *.so files | 10:44 |
| eren | any ideas how to override them? | 10:44 |
| rburton_ | eren: set FILES | 10:44 |
| rburton_ | eren: but why should the lib package contain the .so symlinks? | 10:45 |
| tf | pev, the yocto kernel has configs for each particular machine stored in a git tree, and it generates the .config from that and your custom fragments | 10:45 |
| rburton_ | (unless it's an evil upstream that drops modules into a libdir) | 10:45 |
| eren | rburton_: well, correct me if I am wrong, a isn't it normal for a library package to contain symlink? | 10:46 |
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| pev | tf: Ok - this is for a busybox .config not a kernel, will it still work then? | 10:47 |
| tf | pev, ah, not sure | 10:47 |
| tf | pev: my appologies, I though you meant the kernel | 10:47 |
| tf | eren: .so symlinks belong into the dev package; the runtime package should contain the real, versioned libs | 10:48 |
| rburton_ | eren: no. a normal library package contains eg libfoo.so.1.2 and a libfoo.so.1 symlink. the -dev package contains headers and libfoo.so symlink. | 10:49 |
| pev | tf : No worries, thanks for your help - I'll have a bodge and see what it does! :-) | 10:49 |
| eren | oh | 10:49 |
| eren | http://dpaste.com/1292444/ | 10:49 |
| rburton_ | if you have a real .so file (not a symlink), that's generally a loadable module | 10:49 |
| rburton_ | eren: yes, that's right | 10:49 |
| eren | then it's all normal right now | 10:49 |
| eren | thanks to autotools.bbclass! :) | 10:49 |
| rburton_ | eren: thanks to bitbake.conf | 10:49 |
| rburton_ | eren: this is how libraries work on linux | 10:50 |
| eren | rburton_: yeah, it is a bit hard to understand | 10:50 |
| eren | especially the versioning schema and links | 10:50 |
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| eren | is there a way to check dependency information, other than ldd? | 10:51 |
| rburton_ | it's not that complicated really. real library has major/minor version, abi-compat symlink with major version, and unversioned .so symlink for compile-time. | 10:51 |
| rburton_ | use dpkg or rpm on the generated packages | 10:51 |
| rburton_ | might be useful to add a helper to bb for that | 10:51 |
| eren | rburton_: I use dpkg | 10:51 |
| eren | I'm wondering if I should add DEPENDS vriable on bb | 10:52 |
| rburton_ | eren: dpkg -I will help | 10:52 |
| rburton_ | eren: but for library depends, they get generated for you | 10:52 |
| eren | okkie, I will leave as it is then | 10:53 |
| eren | it is just a small package, shouldn't be a big problem | 10:53 |
| * eren time to package ax25-{tools, apps} | 10:54 | |
| eren | thanks rburton_! | 10:54 |
| Stygia | Hmm another question, as I've given up on using the CPAN classes for this recipe... I've set LIBDIR=${libdir} when calling the Makefile.PL, and yet, it seems the recipe tries to install into /usr/local/ | 10:57 |
| Stygia | Does anyone know if there is a varible like local_libdir? | 10:57 |
| rburton_ | the fix is to stop it installing into /usr/local, not to package up /usr/local/ | 10:58 |
| rburton_ | as your perl won't be looking in there | 10:58 |
| Stygia | Hmm. | 10:59 |
| Stygia | I am just doing this: | 10:59 |
| Stygia | perl Makefile.PL BASE_DIR=${D} DESTDIR=${D} INSTALL_BIN=${bindir} LIBDIR=${libdir} BASELIBDIR=${base_libdir} MANDIR=${mandir} DATADIR=${datadir} | 10:59 |
| Stygia | Then perl Build build and in do_install perl Build install | 10:59 |
| Stygia | rburton_, So I'm a bit thrown off that it still installs into /usr/local/. I figured I'd already told it to use the paths from bb. | 11:00 |
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| bluelightning | Stygia: should you be specifying PREFIX ? | 11:06 |
| ant_work | bluelightning: rburton_: what's happened to the xinput-calibration patch? I've any recent sightnings of it... | 11:06 |
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| Stygia | bluelightning, PREFIX? | 11:09 |
| bluelightning | Stygia: I just googled installing perl modules and found this: http://www.perlmonks.org/?node_id=128077 | 11:10 |
| bluelightning | Stygia: there they are suggesting passing PREFIX= on the perl Makefile.PL command line | 11:10 |
| bluelightning | I'm not sure if that helps | 11:11 |
| pev | Ok... Next fun question :-) Does anyone know much about how quilt works in yocto? I've got a u-boot that has a couple of patches that get applied. If I do a "bitbake -c devshell u-boot" It opens up a devshell and an "ls -l patches/" shows the two patch files and a series file. Now this looks to me that yocto's used quilt to put the dir together (as the docs elude to) but it seems quilt isn't set up for use from the devshell - i.e. a "quilt series" doesnt | 11:14 |
| pev | pick up on whats there. Id have thought I should just be able to go straight into working with the patches in the dir? | 11:14 |
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| tf | pev, pev that should just work | 11:17 |
| Stygia | bluelightning, Hmm. Before I got your advice, I managed to actually get this junk to compile. I sed'd both Makefile.PL and Build.PL to use values from BB for all paths, then used the cpan_build class... and it actually build. | 11:18 |
| Stygia | bluelightning, Thanks for your help anyway dude, you're invaluable. | 11:18 |
| Stygia | bluelightning, Uh, invaluable is good in English, yea? It doesn't mean worthless? | 11:18 |
| bluelightning | Stygia: no problem | 11:18 |
| bluelightning | Stygia: invaluable is correct, and I'm glad you think so :) | 11:19 |
| Stygia | bluelightning, I will admit I think the OE documentation is hard to deal with... it's distributed, not well-used, and generally, finding an answer to "How do I X" is hard (For me at least). IRC helps so much. | 11:19 |
| Stygia | bluelightning, I didn't even know there was a CPAN class when I started writing all these CPAN recipes, until someone here on IRC, probably you or rburton_ I think, told me about it. That must have saved me a few days work. :P | 11:21 |
| fenrig | Okay so I've added ' IMAGE_FEATURES += "splash package-management x11-base" ' to my custom image | 11:29 |
| fenrig | and now I can issue X and Xorg, but it doesn't find a screen (when I boot from the anstrom distro from the internal flash, it does find a screen) | 11:30 |
| fenrig | btw i'm using the serial kernel interface for issueing commands and stuff :) | 11:31 |
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| fenrig | I found out that meta-beagleboard does provide a config file for xorg, and it uses a .bbappend for xorg-xf86-config | 11:40 |
| fenrig | but for some reason it's not automatically added | 11:40 |
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| fenrig | "beaglebone login: Starting Xserver \n Starting system message bus: open /dev/fb0: No such file or directory" | 11:51 |
| fenrig | that's what I get :/ | 11:51 |
| pev | tf: Hm, You're right it should - for whatever reason the devshell hides the output (?!) - if I do a "quilt series | less" I can see it...! also a bit puzzled as I run my build as a normal user but when I invoke devshell it starts in an xterm as root(!) which I don't remember giving it perms for... | 11:54 |
| pev | tf: Doing some digging around, it seems that if I run the devshell then do a "PSEUDO_UNLOAD=1 bash" in it then everything behaves better after..?! | 11:58 |
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| Michael__ | Hi | 12:16 |
| Michael__ | I am trying to create a class which adds a new task after the do_deploy | 12:16 |
| Michael__ | The class is the add to the recipe if that functions needs to be run | 12:16 |
| Michael__ | when I add the class using "inherit <myclass>" its shows the new task when I run listtasks for the receipe | 12:17 |
| Michael__ | However that task is never run | 12:17 |
| Michael__ | Can somebody tell me why it is never run ?? | 12:18 |
| Michael__ | What do I need to do to make it the recipe run that task | 12:18 |
| Michael__ | ??? | 12:18 |
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| romain_ | you can use do_deploy_append | 12:24 |
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| Michael__ | Hi Is ANYBODY listening? | 12:30 |
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| bluelightning | pev: it's not really running as root | 12:32 |
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| bluelightning | pev: it's under pseudo, so pretending to be root to any program that asks within the shell, but has no additional permissions | 12:33 |
| bluelightning | pev: (this is how images can be created containing files owned by root without you having to run the build system as root) | 12:33 |
| Michael__ | I need to implement it as a bbclass so that it is generic | 12:33 |
| bluelightning | Michael__: how are you doing addtask? | 12:34 |
| Michael__ | can I post the example here | 12:34 |
| bluelightning | Michael__: use pastebin.com or similar then paste the link here | 12:34 |
| JaMa | RP spending his sabatical herding cats? :)) | 12:35 |
| Michael__ | its small I will paste here | 12:37 |
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| Michael__ | def findfile (sfilename, dir): import shutil import fnmatch import os matches = [] for root, dirnames, filenames in os.walk(dir): for filename in fnmatch.filter(filenames, sfilename): matches.append(os.path.join(root, filename)) return matches addtask do_signing after do_deploy python do_signing() { matches = [] signfiles = [] deploydir = d.getVar('DEPLOY_DIR_IMAGE', | 12:37 |
| Michael__ | oops | 12:37 |
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| bluelightning | Michael__: just use pastebin please | 12:37 |
| Michael__ | http://pastebin.com/043jpt8F | 12:38 |
| bluelightning | Michael__: it needs to be: addtask signing after do_deploy | 12:39 |
| Michael__ | ok | 12:39 |
| Michael__ | I try that | 12:40 |
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| Michael__ | It still doesn't execute it | 12:44 |
| bluelightning | Michael__: maybe add "before do_build" to that as well | 12:44 |
| Michael__ | ok now it done it | 12:45 |
| Michael__ | thanks a million | 12:46 |
| Michael__ | such a simple thing and it took me ages | 12:46 |
| Michael__ | I have one more question | 12:47 |
| Michael__ | how do I add a dependency to another recipe in a bbclass | 12:48 |
| Michael__ | ? | 12:48 |
| Michael__ | I think it needs to be something like this | 12:48 |
| Michael__ | do_func[deptask] = busybox:do_install | 12:48 |
| Michael__ | ?? | 12:49 |
| Michael__ | any ideas? | 12:49 |
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| bluelightning | Michael__: depends what kind of dependency :) | 12:49 |
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| bluelightning | Michael__: is this for a native tool that the function needs to use? | 12:50 |
| Michael__ | basicly I need to secure sign the files. but that process to run is in another receipe which must be downloaded first | 12:50 |
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| bluelightning | Michael__: ok, that's pretty straightforward | 12:51 |
| Michael__ | can you give an example | 12:51 |
| ant_work | see | 12:52 |
| bluelightning | Michael__: do_signing[depends] += "somerecipe-native:do_populate_sysroot" | 12:52 |
| ant_work | if image: | 12:52 |
| ant_work | d.setVar('INITRAMFS_TASK', '${INITRAMFS_IMAGE}:do_rootfs') | 12:52 |
| ant_work | do_configure[depends] += "${INITRAMFS_TASK}" | 12:52 |
| ant_work | this is kernel.bbclass | 12:52 |
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| bluelightning | Michael__: it's "do_populate_sysroot" that is the key bit, after that the files installed by the recipe are actually installed to the sysroot | 12:52 |
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| Michael__ | ok | 12:53 |
| Michael__ | how do I know where to access the location of the tool in systroot ? | 12:54 |
| Michael__ | is it a matter of running the recipe and checking where it is? | 12:55 |
| bluelightning | Michael__: if the other recipe installs its files to standard locations then you shouldn't need to know, the appropriate paths are already in PATH | 12:56 |
| Michael__ | ok | 12:57 |
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| Michael__ | Do you thing this is a good way to secure sign files? basically this class has a variable SRC_SIGN.. which is set in the recipe and then it looks for it in the deploy_dir_image | 12:59 |
| Michael__ | I'm not really sure what directory I should be looking | 13:00 |
| klinger | hi. I'm facing some problems building a freescale arm image on my new build-host. bitbake isn't able to create the rootfs | 13:00 |
| klinger | ERROR: ld.so: object 'libpseudo.so' from LD_PRELOAD cannot be preloaded: ignored. | 13:00 |
| tf | Michael__: what exactly are you signing? | 13:01 |
| klinger | BTW, the build-host is a lxc container, which might be the problem | 13:02 |
| klinger | any ideas? | 13:02 |
| Michael__ | for example uImage the dtb file daemons | 13:03 |
| tf | uImage would be in the deploy/images dir, but 'normal' packages will not | 13:05 |
| Michael__ | where should I look up those others then | 13:06 |
| tf | are you signing the packages or the files in the packages? | 13:06 |
| Michael__ | It needs to be done for both | 13:06 |
| tf | the packages will be in deploy/<pkgtype>/arch | 13:07 |
| tf | but if you need to sing files in the packages, you probably want to do that during the package build, in the workdir | 13:07 |
| bluelightning | klinger: we have seen other reports of this recently, but I'm not sure what the cause is | 13:09 |
| bluelightning | seebs: any ideas? | 13:09 |
| tf | Michael__: files like uImage you could also sign in the workdir | 13:09 |
| Michael__ | Could you give an example | 13:09 |
| Michael__ | ? | 13:09 |
| klinger | bluelightning: I built the same image on another machine two days ago, so I'm pretty sure LXC is the cause. Maybe some missing capabilities... | 13:10 |
| bluelightning | klinger: is there a way with LXC to report requests on capabilities that aren't enabled/permitted? | 13:11 |
| tf | Michael__: e.g., see the structure of the workdir for the kernel pakcage | 13:11 |
| tf | the uImage ends up in the image/boot subdir | 13:11 |
| klinger | bluelightning: I'm digging through the lxc documentation right now | 13:13 |
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| Michael__ | I dont have an image/boot dir | 13:16 |
| Michael__ | in the workdir | 13:16 |
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| tf | in tmp/work/<arch>/<package> | 13:17 |
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| Michael__ | yep those are in those package directory | 13:23 |
| Michael__ | so those are in $WORKDIR/package/usr/source/uImage | 13:26 |
| Michael__ | *it | 13:26 |
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| Michael__ | so I can access those files for the package directory | 13:28 |
| Michael__ | how to do the addtask | 13:28 |
| Michael__ | so that it would do it when that directory | 13:29 |
| Michael__ | is ready | 13:29 |
| Michael__ | addtask do_signn.. after ?? | 13:29 |
| Michael__ | before ?? | 13:29 |
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| bluelightning | Michael__: how are these signatures intended to be verified? | 13:38 |
| Michael__ | I dont know the answer to that | 13:39 |
| bluelightning | I see | 13:39 |
| Michael__ | basically its secure boot | 13:39 |
| Michael__ | I dont know details | 13:40 |
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| bluelightning | Michael__: well, it might be worth noting that some package systems e.g. rpm have built-in support for signing (if enabled) | 13:40 |
| bluelightning | I don't know if that has any bearing upon secure boot | 13:40 |
| tf | Michael__: ..../install == $D, the files there are ready when the do_install task finished | 13:40 |
| tf | so you | 13:42 |
| tf | can add your signing task after do_install | 13:42 |
| bluelightning | Michael__: alternatively it is pretty easy to extend do_package, just create a function and add it to PACKAGEFUNCS | 13:43 |
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| bluelightning | Michael__: see package.bbclass for reference and buildhistory.bbclass for an example which does just this to look into the contents of each package (before the output package files are created) | 13:43 |
| tf | bluelightning: that might be better option indeed | 13:44 |
| Michael__ | ok will take a look | 13:45 |
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| Michael__ | those files are huge | 13:48 |
| Michael__ | :) | 13:48 |
| bluelightning | yes, they have grown quite large over time | 13:49 |
| Michael__ | ok I think I understand it. I will try to do it this way | 13:53 |
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| Michael__ | big thanks | 13:54 |
| Michael__ | bye | 13:54 |
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| romain_ | Hi erveryone, Does anyone know why qemugl is not present in poky 9.0.0? | 14:18 |
| rburton_ | romain_: it was a patch we were carrying that didn't apply anymore, and there are other similar patches actually heading upstream. decision was to abandon our patch and wait for gl to merge upstream | 14:20 |
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| rburton_ | if you desperately need GL, i believe Tizen has a qemu gl patch | 14:20 |
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| romain_ | Ok thanks for the answer | 14:22 |
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| romain_ | Maybe I will try the Tizen patch in order to enable 3D acceleration | 14:24 |
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| romain_ | If I understand the problem, the only gl implementation with poky 9 is with Mesa | 14:38 |
| rburton_ | well, that's not a problem, run on x86 hw and you get hardware-accelerated GL. | 14:39 |
| rburton_ | other board-specific GL implementations are in the relevant BSP layers | 14:40 |
| romain_ | Yes I understand but I try to enable gl passthrough with qemu | 14:41 |
| rburton_ | so i recommend investigating the tizen sdk, i think they have gl passthrough and hopefully with a modern qemu. | 14:42 |
| romain_ | Ok I will take a look to the tizen project | 14:44 |
| romain_ | Or maybe I will evaluate the performance with virtualbox | 14:47 |
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| romain_ | rburton_: Do you think that virtualbox could enable the 3D acceleration with a qemux86 image? | 14:51 |
| rburton_ | no idea, never used virtualbox | 14:51 |
| mulhern | Is there a way to skip the regeneration of the configure script step using auto tools? | 14:54 |
| mulhern | In a package that inherits from autotools, that is. | 14:54 |
| rburton_ | mulhern: no. | 14:54 |
| bluelightning_ | rburton_: mulhern: er... can't you redefine do_configure to just run oe_runconf? | 14:55 |
| rburton_ | yeah, about to say that | 14:55 |
| rburton_ | if you really can't do it, then just don't use autotools.bbclass | 14:55 |
| bluelightning_ | it's a hack and we try to avoid it, but it does work | 14:55 |
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| rburton_ | but ideally you'll fix upstream if their tarball doesn't autoreconf | 14:55 |
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| mulhern | mulhern: rburton: They also don't supply a Makefile.am. | 15:00 |
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| cristianiorga | YPTM: Cristian present | 15:02 |
| AlexG | YPTM: AlexG here too :) | 15:02 |
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| Song_Liu | YPTM: welcome to the meeting, please let me know who's on the bridge | 15:03 |
| Song_Liu | YPTM: Any opens? | 15:03 |
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| AlexG | https://wiki.yoctoproject.org/wiki/WW27_-_2013-07-03-3_-_Fullpass_Yocto_1.5_M2.RC1 | 15:06 |
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| sgw1 | fray: there seems to be an rpm/lsb issue 4814, do you have time to look at that? | 15:07 |
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| fray | sorry lost context, which RFC? | 15:13 |
| pev | Hi all, am I missing something about devshell? The BSP im using compiles fine if I build the kernel. However if I open the devshell for the kernel and execute a "make uImage" it fails | 15:14 |
| pev | arm-linux-gnueabi-ld: unrecognized option '-Wl,-O1 | 15:14 |
| pev | Shouldn't it be doing exactly the same thing or is something missing in my environment / make invocation? | 15:15 |
| fray | you need to call the make with the same arguments as the system does.. | 15:15 |
| fray | you can find those arguments using either the run file or the log. | 15:15 |
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| pev | fray: Thanks - which log am I looking for? | 15:17 |
| fray | likely the build log.. | 15:17 |
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| fray | I don't have any builds sitting around to look at right now.. sorry | 15:19 |
| fray | (I cleaned everything up yesterday) | 15:19 |
| bluelightning_ | pev: temp/run.do_* under the work directory | 15:20 |
| mulhern | blueligtning_: How redefine? | 15:20 |
| fray | I am | 15:23 |
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| pev | bluelightning_: Nice one, thanks! | 15:23 |
| bluelightning_ | mulhern: one sec | 15:23 |
| pev | Now all I need to do is work out who builds the modules...! | 15:24 |
| kergoth | ugh, there's a number of recipes that suck pam in unconditionally rather than based on the distro feature | 15:24 |
| sgw_ | fray did you seem my above about the rpm bug #4814? | 15:24 |
| yocti | Bug https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4814 normal, Medium+, 1.5 M3, mark.hatle, NEW , rpm is broken on 1.5 M2 RC1 lsb images | 15:24 |
| fray | no.. will look | 15:24 |
| darknighte | kergoth: fun, fun. | 15:24 |
| darknighte | kergoth: approx how many? | 15:24 |
| fray | it looks to me like the rpm database is missing | 15:25 |
| fray | i.e. someone added the clean routine to the install set | 15:25 |
| bluelightning_ | mulhern: see do_configure() in meta/recipes-devtools/tcltk/tcl_8.6.0.bb for an example | 15:25 |
| sgw_ | kergoth: Oh great! I found that with util-linux (thus my patch). | 15:25 |
| rburton_ | kergoth: that's why i added the warning to libpam :) | 15:25 |
| fray | I thought the pam stuff had been figured out.. :/ | 15:26 |
| rburton_ | "dude, you're building stuff that won't work" | 15:26 |
| fray | but yes, everything needs to explicitly state pam requirements | 15:26 |
| sgw_ | That's what I thought also, but the util-linux one popped up recently, it might have been a util-linux update or build timing change. | 15:27 |
| kergoth | rburton_: that warning is very helpful, thanks for adding it, i had no idea | 15:27 |
| rburton_ | kergoth: added it because i spent half a day wondering why my pam stuff wasn't working, before discovering that adding the distro-feature helps ;) | 15:28 |
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| kergoth | haha | 15:28 |
| kergoth | i hate those days | 15:28 |
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| rburton_ | it was one of those "but... why... oooooooooooh. whoops." moments. | 15:33 |
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| soldoKyn | hi to all! here "http://downloads.yoctoproject.org/releases/yocto/yocto-1.4/toolchain/x86_64/" there's a cross-toolchain tarball for cross-compiling application. But the arm version is for armv5 based hardware. there's a tarball for armv7 based hardware? thanks! | 16:11 |
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| lpapp | hi, is there an option for a bit more verbose output other than this: | 16:39 |
| lpapp | Currently 1 running tasks (165 of 1614): | 16:39 |
| lpapp | 0: gcc-cross-initial-4.8.1-r0 do_compile (pid 12859) | 16:39 |
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| rburton_ | lpapp: do bitbake whatever|cat and you'll get a bit more detailed | 16:51 |
| rburton_ | lpapp: or just tail the logs in the work directories if you want the compile lines | 16:51 |
| rburton_ | (which would be crazy when you've got 8 threads and parallel make) | 16:51 |
| rburton_ | fwiw, wind river linux does have a realtime log level changing feature | 16:51 |
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| lpapp | well, the user needs to get some feedback stuff is not stuck. | 16:55 |
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| mr_science | moin | 16:56 |
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| rburton_ | lpapp: the flip-side is that previously it did log the stages, and you had no idea what really was happening because it was scrolling past. | 17:27 |
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| lpapp | rburton_: that would be fine because you could get an idea at the end of the compilation unit. | 17:29 |
| lpapp | just like gentoo does fwiw. | 17:29 |
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| lpapp | rburton_: I need to leave and have to turn the PC off. Is there a way to suspend it, and continue from where it is, tomorrow? | 17:38 |
| lpapp | it would be a bit unproductive to start from scratch | 17:39 |
| lpapp | here it is now: Currently 1 running tasks (358 of 1614): | 17:39 |
| lpapp | 0: linux-yocto-3.8.13+gitAUTOINC+f121c06ae8_f20047520a-r4.2 do_fetch (pid 19088) | 17:39 |
| walters | sadly git doesn't support resuming checkouts | 17:40 |
| walters | on SIGINT it will remove everything it downloaded | 17:40 |
| lpapp | well, yes, but I can wait for the build to start maybe. | 17:40 |
| lpapp | if it is a few minutes maximum. | 17:40 |
| walters | OE should really export a mechanism to allow --depth=1 clones, for the same reasons as outlined in https://git.gnome.org/browse/jhbuild/commit/?id=40b70d75563f783cf41c403e7c797ab683803c52 | 17:41 |
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| walters | lpapp, but broadly speaking, you can just Control-C the thing, and yes, it will pick up where it left off | 17:41 |
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| Lahar | Hi All, I just build fsl-image-core and trying to put it on P4080PCIE board using tftp server but getting this error - VFS: Mounted root (ext2 filesystem) readonly on device 1:0. Freeing unused kernel memory: 260k init INIT: version 2.88 booting /etc/init.d/rcS: line 27: /etc/hostname: Read-only file system Starting udev Missing devtmpfs, which is required for udev to run Halting... INIT: Switching to runlevel: 0 INIT: Sending processes t | 17:54 |
| Lahar | bluelightning: could you please help me with my question? You have been helping me so you might understand my question better. Pleaseeeeeeeeeeee | 17:55 |
| bluelightning | Lahar: sounds like devtmpfs is not enabled in your kernel config | 17:56 |
| Lahar | bluelightning: Thank you very much for replying! Any idea how do I enable it? | 17:56 |
| bluelightning | Lahar: if you haven't specified the kernel config yourself I suspect the BSP you are using has a bug | 17:57 |
| Lahar | bluelightning: oh ok so I should ask freescale people then | 17:58 |
| bluelightning | Lahar: I think that's probably the best course yes | 17:58 |
| Lahar | bluelightning: Thank you very much for your help! really appreciate it. | 17:58 |
| rburton_ | so good news, tizen's gl stuff is here: https://review.tizen.org/git/?p=sdk/emulator/qemu.git;a=tree;hb=5b17056e3d5c144103dd2c3d71466482093bfa8c. bad news, it's forked from qemu 1.2.0 | 18:05 |
| Crofton|work | we need a competition to do things for the YP with millions of $$ as prizes too | 18:06 |
| rburton_ | heh, good luck with that :) | 18:07 |
| seebs | That is an awesome idea. Someone should declare a $5M prize for "best improvement in pseudo's diagnostic messages", for instance. | 18:08 |
| walters | hm | 18:16 |
| walters | fairly lame that tizen copied spec files from at least fedora, stripping the changelog | 18:16 |
| * walters recognizes his own signature in "Die libtool, die." =) https://review.tizen.org/git/?p=profile/ivi/gobject-introspection.git;a=blob;f=packaging/gobject-introspection.spec;h=1da5cbe9d7d4c33dcaf7a712ee0192bdd193918b;hb=HEAD | 18:16 | |
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| lab | Packages created by yocto are default .rpm... Is it easy to modify packages to be .tar.gz? | 18:42 |
| fray | packages are created in whatever format you select in your local.conf file | 18:45 |
| fray | see 'PACKAGE_CLASSES' | 18:45 |
| lab | ok | 18:48 |
| lab | there is option for 3 package classes. Is this full list? | 18:48 |
| lab | perhaps I can set the PACKAGE_CLASSES = package_tar | 18:54 |
| fray | look at meta/classes .. I believe there is a package_tar, I don't know how well it works | 18:56 |
| lab | thats where I found it. I will try run it tomo | 18:57 |
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| lpapp | does bitbake build with all the cores possible as default, or I need to have the MAKEFLAGS set accordingly? | 19:02 |
| fray | the system builds for the machine you have configured.. | 19:02 |
| fray | or are you talking parallel builds? | 19:02 |
| lpapp | yes, parallel builds. | 19:03 |
| fray | top of the local.conf are settings for parallel package builds and parallel (make) arguments | 19:03 |
| fray | BB_NUMBER_THREADS ?= "32" | 19:03 |
| fray | PARALLEL_MAKE ?= "-j 32" | 19:03 |
| fray | (what I use on my builder.. 16 core + HT and 128 GB of ram) | 19:03 |
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| lpapp | you seem to have a pretty hefty machine. :) | 19:06 |
| fray | yup.. very lucky | 19:06 |
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| lpapp | is it possible somehow to get the built stuff removed automatically for the corresponding packages? | 19:33 |
| lpapp | the problem is that a fully poky requires a lot of GBs which I may not have available. | 19:33 |
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| walters | lpapp, add INHERIT += "rm_work" to your local.conf | 19:36 |
| mr_science | don't forget downloads... | 19:38 |
| mr_science | but rm_work is probably the biggest space-saving option | 19:38 |
| mr_science | i ended up separating OEBASE SCRATCH and DL_DIR on my oo-classic build machine | 19:41 |
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| lpapp | walters: problem is, I already started the build process. Can I remove some dedicated files manually? | 19:49 |
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| lpapp | I guess it is the tmp folder into which I should look | 19:51 |
| mr_science | yup | 19:55 |
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| lpapp | what can I safely delete in there? | 19:58 |
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| mr_science | during a build? that might be a little dicey... | 20:00 |
| lpapp | the build stopped | 20:01 |
| lpapp | due to the space running out. | 20:01 |
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| mr_science | but i would start with tmp/work/[mach]/* | 20:01 |
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| lpapp | when is local.conf evaluated? | 20:02 |
| lpapp | if I set "rm_work" now, will it get evaluated if I restart the core image creation? | 20:02 |
| mr_science | when bitbake is launched if i understand your question... | 20:02 |
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| mr_science | lpapp: yup | 20:03 |
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| lpapp | I mean, does it even remove the old works? | 20:03 |
| mr_science | probably leave existing cruft tho | 20:03 |
| lpapp | or it is just taking the new builds into account for removal? | 20:03 |
| mr_science | the latter sounds correct | 20:03 |
| lpapp | Q: How do I create my own source download mirror ? | 20:04 |
| lpapp | A: Make a complete build with these variables set in your conf/local.conf: | 20:04 |
| lpapp | that is a bit ambiguous, isn't it ... | 20:04 |
| mr_science | deleting everything under tmp/work should be safe... | 20:04 |
| lpapp | what conf is it referring to? | 20:04 |
| lpapp | Can someone update the wiki to be more straight-forward/ | 20:04 |
| lpapp | it is not clear to me what it is referring to. | 20:04 |
| lpapp | https://wiki.yoctoproject.org/wiki/How_do_I | 20:05 |
| lpapp | right the first question. | 20:05 |
| lpapp | sorry, second. | 20:05 |
| mr_science | conf/local.conf is created for each build you run "oe-init... foo" for | 20:05 |
| lpapp | I cannot set stuff globally? | 20:06 |
| mr_science | so it's pretty much local.conf for tuning, bblayers.conf for layer config, etc | 20:06 |
| lpapp | I mean, rm work is not really target specific. | 20:06 |
| lpapp | it is a global behavior I would like to have. | 20:06 |
| mr_science | what you mean by "global" is probably in the machine defaults | 20:06 |
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| lpapp | machine default means? | 20:06 |
| mr_science | meta-machine layers should have a conf/[distro|machine] set of config files | 20:07 |
| mr_science | eg, => https://github.com/sarnold/meta-raspberrypi/tree/master/conf | 20:08 |
| lpapp | well, I have several meta folders. | 20:08 |
| lpapp | that still does not make it clear. | 20:08 |
| lpapp | besides, by global, I really mean global. :) | 20:08 |
| mr_science | not all are meta-machine tho | 20:08 |
| lpapp | i.e. not separately for each meta, etc. | 20:08 |
| lpapp | I have no clue what you mean by machine., | 20:08 |
| lpapp | machine.* | 20:09 |
| mr_science | something under poky/conf then? | 20:09 |
| lpapp | poky/conf means? | 20:09 |
| mr_science | in the example, raspberrypi is a machine | 20:09 |
| lpapp | Yocto is a complex stuff as I see. :) | 20:09 |
| mr_science | is there a poky/conf dir? | 20:09 |
| lpapp | no | 20:09 |
| lpapp | first of all, I cloned poky. | 20:09 |
| mr_science | i'm not home right now, so i can't check easily | 20:10 |
| lpapp | second, I do not have a conf file inside the poky folder.. I checked that as that would sound natural for a global conf. | 20:10 |
| mr_science | hmm | 20:10 |
| mr_science | a conf *folder* | 20:10 |
| lpapp | folder is a file. | 20:11 |
| mr_science | technically everything is a file in linux... | 20:11 |
| mr_science | look in poky/meta-yocto/conf | 20:12 |
| lpapp | look at what? | 20:13 |
| mr_science | the conf files, etc | 20:13 |
| mr_science | that's probably the closest to "global" yocto config | 20:14 |
| lpapp | cannot we just have a global conf right in the root folder, or ~ ? :D | 20:14 |
| lpapp | why is it this complex? | 20:14 |
| lpapp | I would not imagine setting up a global setting is this unusual. | 20:14 |
| lpapp | anyway, could you please fix the wiki? | 20:16 |
| lpapp | I understand it is a bit vague for newcomers. | 20:16 |
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| lpapp | I wonder why there is no ~/.yoctorc or concept. | 20:25 |
| lpapp | the current establishment seems 1) Weird with linux culture 2) Not intuitive at first glance. | 20:26 |
| walters | lpapp, having written a build system that i just switched from ~/.config to in-build-dir config, it's because you really want to be able to do two builds at once | 20:28 |
| walters | stable and development branch, etc | 20:28 |
| lpapp | those are not exclusive .... | 20:28 |
| lpapp | I spent 30-60 minutes with it | 20:29 |
| lpapp | and I still have not got the faintest idea about where to put and what to avoid the GB hell. | 20:30 |
| lpapp | seems it did not survive the automated stop ... http://paste.kde.org/~lpapp/792686/ | 20:33 |
| * lpapp sighs | 20:33 | |
| * lpapp starts again from scratch that maybe 30 GB will be enough .... | 20:33 | |
| lpapp | can someone please give me a file path where I can put an "rm work" config that will be valid for any kinda build? | 20:36 |
| lpapp | IMO, this should be one of the very first FAQ questions. | 20:36 |
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| mulhern | lpapp: /poky/build/conf/local.conf | 21:05 |
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| mr_science | lpapp: i'd try poky/meta/conf | 21:22 |
| lpapp | mulhern: mr_science I already checked the quick guide in the meantime. | 21:23 |
| mr_science | well, local.conf would be the typical place but it's not a "global" conf as you've requested | 21:23 |
| lpapp | we deserve a global conf | 21:24 |
| lpapp | please bring the ~/.yoctorc style back. | 21:24 |
| mr_science | depends on whether all *.conf files are read or not | 21:25 |
| lpapp | mulhern: there is no build folder initially ... | 21:25 |
| mr_science | you could try adding one in poky/meta/conf and see what happens | 21:25 |
| mr_science | do a "bitbake -e" and see if gets picked up | 21:25 |
| lpapp | mr_science: I really do not wanna mess locally. | 21:26 |
| lpapp | I will get back to yocto in my hobby when ~/.yoctorc exists. | 21:26 |
| mr_science | or you can live with local.conf for now... | 21:26 |
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| mr_science | yocto is my side project too, as long as we're using oe-classic for work stuff... | 21:27 |
| lpapp | it is such a basic feature that even minimalistic programs implemented.... | 21:27 |
| lpapp | I really cannot understand how it is missing for Yocto. | 21:27 |
| mr_science | it would say odds are it's not "missing" rather it's hidden somewhere not obviuous to us... | 21:27 |
| lpapp | cat meta/conf/local.conf | 21:28 |
| lpapp | INHERIT += "rm_work" | 21:28 |
| lpapp | it is so well hidden that it makes users' life a royal pain. ;) | 21:28 |
| mr_science | check with bitbake -e | grep local | 21:28 |
| lpapp | if I use git clean -fdx | 21:29 |
| lpapp | it will be gone. | 21:29 |
| lpapp | so I need to redo /all/ the time for the ... sake. :) | 21:29 |
| kergoth | .yoctorc would be global to all your builds, not local. | 21:29 |
| mr_science | not sure i understand that one... | 21:29 |
| kergoth | if you want an equivalent, do what i do, add ~/.oe to BBPATH in your bblayers.conf and create a ~/.oe/conf/site.conf | 21:29 |
| lpapp | mr_science: using git master | 21:29 |
| lpapp | mr_science: what do you think will happen to the local non-versioned files? | 21:30 |
| lpapp | when you clean up the repository for good? | 21:30 |
| mr_science | i'd say try what kergoth said | 21:30 |
| lpapp | kergoth: I DO NOT WANNA MODIFY THE GIT SOURCE | 21:30 |
| kergoth | first of all, you can put your build dirs anywhre, not just inside poky | 21:30 |
| lpapp | I just wanna build it. | 21:30 |
| kergoth | i didn't tell you to modify the git source | 21:30 |
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| kergoth | so shove your yelling up your ass | 21:30 |
| lpapp | I wanna have local global config without touching the damn source. | 21:30 |
| kergoth | listen to what i say, not what you want to hear | 21:30 |
| kergoth | you do not have to modify git in any way | 21:31 |
| lpapp | yes, you have to. | 21:31 |
| kergoth | i run plenty of builds with those dirs set entirely read only | 21:31 |
| kergoth | wrong. | 21:31 |
| lpapp | as for me, Yocto is is a pet project at this point. :) | 21:31 |
| lpapp | once it can have proper local global configuration, I will consider it. | 21:32 |
| lpapp | it is such a basic feature. | 21:32 |
| lpapp | the source should be able to parse a ~/.yoctorc off-hand. | 21:32 |
| kergoth | it can already do waht you want, you just don't want to bother to learn enough to accomplish it | 21:32 |
| lpapp | kergoth: you do not even understand the feature | 21:32 |
| kergoth | haha | 21:32 |
| lpapp | you are talking about build dirs | 21:32 |
| lpapp | who cares about build dirs? | 21:32 |
| lpapp | I wanna use the default stuff | 21:32 |
| lpapp | with a local global config | 21:32 |
| mr_science | no, he's telling you how to do what you want with the current implementation | 21:33 |
| lpapp | you did not even understand that simple bit. | 21:33 |
| Crofton|work | the concept of suggesting kergoth does not know something is laughable | 21:33 |
| kergoth | i already told you how to accmoplish what you want. it's a one line change to your build direcotry to make it obey a file in your homedir. trivial. | 21:33 |
| lpapp | mr_science: I DO NOT WANNA royal pain. | 21:33 |
| kergoth | if you're too lazy to do that, i really can't help you | 21:33 |
| Crofton|work | kergoth, /ignore him | 21:33 |
| lpapp | mr_science: you can work around everything, but I do not wanna. | 21:33 |
| lpapp | I wanna have a basic feature present off-hand. | 21:33 |
| * kergoth rolls eyes and goes back to real work :) | 21:33 | |
| mr_science | that doesn't sound like a workaround... | 21:33 |
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| lpapp | mr_science: have you ever used essential unix tools? | 21:34 |
| lpapp | which handle a config file in the home directory off-hand? | 21:34 |
| lpapp | interesting, they did not do the way yocto is hacking around, and they have been around for decades. | 21:34 |
| mr_science | only since the early 90's... | 21:34 |
| lpapp | right, tell me why vim handles ~/.vimrc off-hand? | 21:35 |
| lpapp | or feh, ~/.fehrc | 21:35 |
| lpapp | et cetera | 21:35 |
| mr_science | in fact, most modern "things" have gone away from the ~/.foorc concept | 21:35 |
| lpapp | no | 21:35 |
| lpapp | kde4 is still having config stuff in the home folder. | 21:35 |
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| mr_science | look in ~/config and ~/local | 21:35 |
| lpapp | or in /var/ | 21:35 |
| kergoth | a lot of folks don't understand the inherent flexibility which is a priority for bitbake, nor do they grasp that it's intended to meet all sorts of needs. one of the original design requirements for OE was that it was able to be entirely self contained, as buildroot is | 21:35 |
| ant_home | lpapp, you fail to understand the same user could run many parallel builds in different dirs | 21:36 |
| lpapp | ant_home: huh?! | 21:36 |
| lpapp | mr_science: please do not play word games | 21:36 |
| lpapp | mr_science: I believe, you understand the concept of "home config". | 21:36 |
| lpapp | a dedicated stuff which is parsed off-hand by the software. | 21:37 |
| mr_science | yeah, just no more umpty-ump .rc files everywhere... | 21:37 |
| lpapp | but honetly, it could be in etc, et cetera... could not care less. | 21:37 |
| kergoth | "local.conf" is named the way it is becaues that's what it is, local to the build. if you want to configure site-wide, you can use site.conf. | 21:37 |
| lpapp | all I care, I wanna run stuff off-hand with out-of-box config, and I expect it to work just like in many other projects ... | 21:37 |
| mr_science | still, kergoth gave you the answer you need, maybe just not the one you wanted | 21:37 |
| kergoth | I can see why one might want it to obey a dotfile, but it'd be difficult to meet everyone's needs with hardcoded behavior, which is why bitbake obeys BBPATH and BBFILES, to provide the necessarily flexiblity | 21:37 |
| kergoth | further, yocto is often just a starting point, not an end goal | 21:38 |
| lpapp | mr_science: no, he explained a workaround | 21:38 |
| kergoth | many projects build their own setup scripts and tools on top of it, such as angstrom and shr | 21:38 |
| lpapp | which I explained in the very beginning, I do not care. | 21:38 |
| mr_science | no, how you use a tool *correctly* i would not call a workaround | 21:38 |
| lpapp | yes, it makes so much sense to set "rm_work" many times when I wanna have a global config | 21:39 |
| kergoth | Personally, I find stuff to get irritated with in oe, yocto, and bitbake on a regular basis, I just don't think this is a valid instance of that, nor am I seeing a use case that'd be met by introducing use of a dotfile that can't already be met with greater flexibility by what it does today | 21:39 |
| lpapp | or make it totally tied to the build or source tree .... | 21:39 |
| mulhern | Is there anyway I can get do_qa_configure to be more informative? | 21:39 |
| kergoth | Crofton|work: heh, there's plnety of stuff I don't know, even about yocto (package_rpm is voodoo, i say!) but the implication that I don't understand how a dotfile works *is* laughable :) | 21:40 |
| mulhern | It says: This autoconf log indicates errors, it looked at host include and/or library paths while determining system capabilities. | 21:41 |
| lpapp | mr_science: anyway, I already lost my motivation to provide feedback | 21:41 |
| kergoth | there's an argument to be made that bitbake doesn't really follow unix philosophy | 21:42 |
| lpapp | this was a very hostile way of turning it down. | 21:42 |
| kergoth | mulhern: the autoconf log is config.log in the build directory, you should be able to examine that to find the problematic compiler execution | 21:42 |
| mulhern | kergoth: What kind of thing should I be looking for? | 21:42 |
| kergoth | as the message says, it's poking into your build machine instead of the sysroot. e.g. looking in /usr/include, /usr/lib, whatever | 21:43 |
| kergoth | best to check for problematic -I and -L | 21:43 |
| * lpapp tries to avoid Yocto as much as possible until there is a truly global way of configuring it. | 21:43 | |
| kergoth | could be something hardcoded in one of hte makefiles | 21:43 |
| * lpapp does not wish to spend time to configure it each time something changes | 21:44 | |
| kergoth | tough to crosscompile for arm if it's poking at x86 libraries :) (or what hve you) | 21:44 |
| kergoth | I could see an argument for moving just the settings which are not build specific, and which govern bitbake behavior exclusively into a dotfile, but at the time we were writing the code, we felt that introducing a second config file foramt when we already had one which we used everywhere would be unnecessary, from what i recall | 21:45 |
| mr_science | mulhern: what is in your recipe now for autoconf? i've had to add some autoreconf stuff before using the --cross argument | 21:46 |
| kergoth | every other week i feel like throwing bitbake out a window, but the rest of hte time i thank god i have it, because there just isn't anything else that meets the same needs. it has its annoyances and quirks, but it gets the jobd one, and the way the yocto project is helping compnaies to stop wasting money on the baseline setup which isn't their value add, thereby letting them focus on what *is*, is lovely | 21:46 |
| lpapp | in fact, I cannot mention a project where the configuration is this tiresome when possible. | 21:47 |
| lpapp | and it is totally os agnostic observation. | 21:47 |
| lpapp | coming to Yocto was a de-evolution to me in this sense. :) | 21:48 |
| mr_science | i guess i don't understand why you're so stuck on the preconceived idea of how it should be configured... | 21:49 |
| lpapp | because I think with user hat on, not developer? | 21:50 |
| lpapp | as the end users are actually users? | 21:50 |
| mulhern | mr_science: Nothing special, actually. I had to move an aclocal.m4 that came in the distribution to an acinclude.m4 so it wouldn't be destroyed. | 21:50 |
| lpapp | and as it seems, it is an architectural issue ... :( | 21:50 |
| kergoth | mulhern: make sure that didn't inclue other non-local macros that should be pulled from other packages. when oyu run aclocal, it pulls macros from all over and shoves them into aclocal.m4, so if their build ever used it, it could have more than just the bits you want kept. really depend on the buildsystem in question, of course. | 21:51 |
| kergoth | e.g. read it and make sure there's no AC_PROG_LIBTOOL and crap :) | 21:51 |
| mr_science | i've hit a handful of autotools-based recipes where i had similar errors | 21:51 |
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| mr_science | usually doing autoreconf with the right args takes care of it | 21:52 |
| * lpapp should check for existing bugreports in the hope of having had this reported already with many votes on it | 21:52 | |
| ant_home | lpapp, please stop ranting and try to understand how it works instead | 21:53 |
| ant_home | there is no way your local.conf get rewritten after git pull | 21:54 |
| fray | if you have suggestions on making something better, that's one thing.. but just complaining doesn't solve anyone's problem | 21:54 |
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| lpapp | I already told the master idea from the minute first. | 21:54 |
| * fray routinely uses the same local.conf (and other configurations) for multiple builds and multiple machines | 21:54 | |
| lpapp | please stop this "just complaining" incorrect tsuff | 21:55 |
| lpapp | stuff* | 21:55 |
| lpapp | it is not constructive. | 21:55 |
| lpapp | ant_home: I already understood what it means, but that is vastly different to what I need | 21:55 |
| lpapp | ant_home: please read back, and try to understand the whole conversation without half-reading it. | 21:55 |
| fray | lpapp, yes your complaing is not currently constructive.. what do you want the system to do, what doesn't it do for you? | 21:55 |
| ant_home | you're right I lack first part of it, though I get a bad impression | 21:56 |
| lpapp | fray: :( | 21:56 |
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| lpapp | fray: you did not bother to read the conversation through. :( | 21:56 |
| lpapp | I wrote at least 5-10 times what I propose. | 21:56 |
| lpapp | and then why the current system is worse. | 21:56 |
| fray | Sorry, I'm not going to scroll back 14 pages to find the start.. | 21:56 |
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| fray | I looked back over the last 5 minutes starting with complaints about somethign VIM related.. | 21:56 |
| lpapp | if you are not interested in the proposal and problem, why do you ask ? | 21:56 |
| fray | I still don't see what the problem is you are having and what you want | 21:56 |
| lpapp | if you keep rolling another page without reading the previous pages, it will get worse for others to read through ... | 21:57 |
| b46258 | the problem seems to be that quite a bit of disk space is used, and lpapp would like to automatically run rm_work as part of every build anywhere on the system to conserve disk space. | 21:57 |
| mr_science | fray: he wants a .yoctorc file to work instead of kergoth's answer | 21:57 |
| fray | ok.. | 21:58 |
| mr_science | anything more than that got lost in the noise... | 21:58 |
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| fray | sounds like you want a local - local.conf to be loaded... | 21:58 |
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| mr_science | a "global" local.conf... | 21:58 |
| fray | 'local' as in his own, vs what everyone else uses | 21:59 |
| lpapp | global or semi-global, yes. | 21:59 |
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| lpapp | "he wants" is a bit underestimation, a few people agreed upon this when I mentioned. | 22:00 |
| fray | our product(s) generate the local.conf for the user.. but in essence they have a series of include/require statements in addition to what the local.conf sample normally has you configure | 22:00 |
| fray | so my recommendation is simply use an include/require at the beginning/end of your local.conf to pickup your site config | 22:00 |
| ant_home | lpapp, see this usecase: I'm building Angstrom with rm_work and oe-core without it | 22:01 |
| fray | or if that is too complicated, put it in your own layer, and have the layer's layer.conf pull in those ocnfiguration settings | 22:01 |
| lpapp | fray: so you propose two steps instead of one | 22:01 |
| lpapp | surely, your user hat is off? | 22:01 |
| fray | no, I have you two alternatives | 22:01 |
| fray | actually three.. | 22:01 |
| mr_science | every new build needs a layer config | 22:01 |
| fray | 1) write your own configuration program that generates the appropriate local.conf for your projects.. | 22:02 |
| fray | 2) echo "include /home/user/.yoctorc" >> conf/local.conf | 22:02 |
| mr_science | adding your own layer config is about the same as what kergoth said... | 22:02 |
| fray | 3) make your own layer with the include (or YOUR configuration) and include the layer | 22:02 |
| lpapp | ok, let us agree to disagree | 22:02 |
| lpapp | I will look for a bugreport and vote, and invite others who agree with me. | 22:02 |
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| lpapp | once, it gets somewhat reasonable vote numbers, I will bring it up on the mailing list. | 22:03 |
| lpapp | or perhaps even before... | 22:03 |
| b46258 | ...and if it doesn't? :-) | 22:03 |
| * fray waits to see your proposed code.... | 22:03 | |
| lpapp | thing is, telling 3 steps to the end user instead of 1 is like taken the user hat off. | 22:03 |
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| fray | not three steps, three -ways- of doing the same thing.. | 22:04 |
| lpapp | fray: seriously, you have not realized I am not proposing code? | 22:04 |
| fray | bitbake/oe/yocto project gives you all of the rope you could ever need to do whatever you need.. | 22:04 |
| fray | it's up to you to hang yourself | 22:04 |
| lpapp | code is seconday here. | 22:04 |
| lpapp | we are discussing *use case requirements*. | 22:04 |
| b46258 | lpapp: I think everyone is aware you are not offering code. | 22:04 |
| fray | You can have your use case requirements.. if you really need it.. implement it and submit it.. don't expect others to.. | 22:05 |
| fray | bitbake/oe/yocto project work by people submitting RFCs and code.. | 22:05 |
| lpapp | b46258: 23:04 * fray waits to see your proposed code.... | 22:05 |
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| lpapp | b46258: that was a joke? | 22:05 |
| lpapp | fray: do not be hostile. | 22:05 |
| fray | if you think something is useful, start with an RFC.. hey I think this would be useful.. | 22:05 |
| lpapp | feedback is welcome. | 22:05 |
| lpapp | read the documentation. | 22:05 |
| fray | then submit code to implement it.. | 22:05 |
| b46258 | lpapp: not specifically a joke, but an ironic pointer to what would have a chance at changing minds. | 22:05 |
| fray | I'm being serious, just complaining about a problem (real or not) won't get it fixed.. | 22:05 |
| lpapp | b46258: I do not follow. | 22:06 |
| fray | unless your problem happens to be someone elses problem.. they're not going to work on a solution | 22:06 |
| lpapp | fray: no one is complaining. | 22:06 |
| lpapp | you brought up the "complaining hostile" handling of a proposal. | 22:06 |
| lpapp | I outlined my problems with the current way, and I explained why a one-step shot for any build, git, whatsoever scenarios. | 22:07 |
| lpapp | it is not called complaining. | 22:07 |
| lpapp | it is called discussion. | 22:07 |
| lpapp | it is called feedback | 22:07 |
| fray | currently if someone wants help setting up local.conf, their solution is to use one of the many oe/yocto based distributions that has their own "helper" infrastructure, or use hob.. | 22:07 |
| lpapp | it is called helping the project to move forward from my point of view. | 22:07 |
| b46258 | at first glance, this seems like a very circuituous way to address the actual problem you had, lpapp | 22:07 |
| fray | exactly | 22:07 |
| lpapp | ok, I will stop providing feedback here now. | 22:08 |
| lpapp | honestly, I spend my leisure time to improve things, and this is all I get. | 22:08 |
| lpapp | I do not need this. | 22:08 |
| lpapp | and by this, I do not mean disagreement because that is natural. | 22:08 |
| b46258 | and I think discussion got difficult and complaining easy when most people agreed there are ways to solve your problems and you said they are not acceptable. | 22:08 |
| lpapp | b46258: please stop this shit | 22:09 |
| fray | exactly.. there are many possible solutions within the existing architecture/implementation. If none of them are adequate, then explain why they're not... | 22:09 |
| lpapp | there is no complaining outside your brain and fray's. | 22:09 |
| lpapp | fray: sigh, I did many times, and there are several people here who understood. | 22:10 |
| lpapp | please ask them, I cannot help you apparently. | 22:10 |
| lpapp | I accept that others disagree with my proposal as it seemed about a few people. | 22:10 |
| lpapp | but I do not accept not listening to my words. | 22:10 |
| lpapp | or well, actually I do not care. | 22:10 |
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| lpapp | it is so obviously not about whether I can hack stuff around | 22:14 |
| lpapp | or whether it is possible. | 22:14 |
| ant_home | lpapp, we are sorry for having put you in that bad mood. We'v got your point, you didn't want to see ours. Now pls go trolling elsewhere then maybe send a bugreport or better an RFC. | 22:14 |
| lpapp | there is a huge difference between possible and a very good solution. | 22:14 |
| b46258 | I'm not trying to argue with you. You've been very clear about what problems you've had, and what you think would improve that. | 22:14 |
| lpapp | ant_home: sorry, but I need to put you on ignore. | 22:14 |
| lpapp | ant_home: as you are not being objective here. | 22:14 |
| ant_home | lpapp, everyone here is open to new proposal. Send it and it will be preciously considered as always | 22:15 |
| lpapp | I will read cautiously next time the Yocto manual when it is writing "feedback is welcome" | 22:16 |
| lpapp | it is here turning out to be called "trolling" for one. | 22:16 |
| lpapp | that makes me sad... | 22:16 |
| lpapp | b46258: good to hear.. | 22:17 |
| b46258 | but "please stop this shit" does not really make me sympathetic to you. | 22:17 |
| lpapp | b46258: you started, not me. | 22:18 |
| lpapp | you accused me with "complaining" which is a well, very rude and unfriendly to say the least. | 22:18 |
| lpapp | where is the good faith? :) | 22:18 |
| b46258 | I was explaining where the good faith went, actually. | 22:19 |
| lpapp | anyway, I need to be careful with "feedback is welcome" in the Yocto project. | 22:19 |
| b46258 | "most people agreed there are ways to solve your problems and you said they are not acceptable." | 22:19 |
| lpapp | b46258: I do not wanna know your bad faith if good is "accusing others with complaining". | 22:19 |
| b46258 | maybe complaining is a really horrible thing to you, I dunno. *shrug* | 22:20 |
| lpapp | but yes, "stop this bad faith" would have been more adequate. | 22:20 |
| b46258 | I don't much mind it, but it *is* different from constructive criticism or feedback. | 22:20 |
| lpapp | yes, those are good faith, and you had a bad IMO. | 22:22 |
| b46258 | I am vastly more interested in addressing the actual problem you had, and working to make it not a problem, than I am with your proposed solution. | 22:22 |
| b46258 | I am not particularly concerned with what motivations you ascribe to me, either. :-) | 22:22 |
| lpapp | why do you continue if you are not interested in improving the situation? | 22:23 |
| lpapp | and no, putting stuff in the build is NOT a solution. | 22:23 |
| b46258 | ... | 22:24 |
| lpapp | what if you remove the build dir as I said before? | 22:24 |
| lpapp | say, in a month? | 22:24 |
| lpapp | and you can back in half a year? | 22:24 |
| lpapp | you need to re-read everything? | 22:24 |
| lpapp | instead of just storing an intermittent config file, and be happy when you come back? | 22:24 |
| lpapp | surely, that would be tiresome? | 22:24 |
| lpapp | or if you remove the build dir, and create another one elsewhere with different name, etc? | 22:24 |
| fray | maybe that is the problem, you are viewing the configuration file as intermittent.. it's not intended to be.. | 22:24 |
| lpapp | or what if the build dir is accessible by one user? | 22:25 |
| lpapp | by the config should be taken into account for each unix user? | 22:25 |
| b46258 | my reading of the chat log is that the actual problem you had was running out of disk space | 22:25 |
| fray | the configuration (local.conf) -is- the build control file, and what you would version in your local git (or similar) repository to ensure reproducability | 22:25 |
| lpapp | Those problems are currently unresolved. | 22:25 |
| lpapp | my proposal would solve those as far as I can tell. | 22:25 |
| kergoth | he was complaining earlier about using git clean -f and having his local.conf and all blown away, i tried to explain that he can put the build directory wherever he wants, but he didn't seem to grasp the concept | 22:25 |
| kergoth | heh | 22:25 |
| b46258 | adding rm_work to the build steps is the current solution, and the places in which you would need to add that are too tiresome and changing. | 22:25 |
| lpapp | b46258: current sucky solution, yes. | 22:26 |
| fray | yes, I never use the build directory in the same location as my git tree (poky, oe-core/bitbake or anything else).. build is always outside | 22:26 |
| lpapp | b46258: I need more than a sucky situation. | 22:26 |
| lpapp | as I explained at least 10 times now. | 22:26 |
| fray | and that gives me the ability to put my build tree into a repository if it's a build I need to reproduce in the future | 22:26 |
| lpapp | that is why I proposed a way for which I have not heard a rebruttal yet. | 22:26 |
| b46258 | but the *problem* is related to disk space, and your proposed solution is "~/.yoctorc" | 22:26 |
| lpapp | no | 22:27 |
| lpapp | the problem is explicitly not related to disk space | 22:27 |
| fray | one of the objections of the community is that sourcing in a ~/.yoctorc would cause a build to not be reproducable with different user environments.. | 22:27 |
| kergoth | maybe he doesn't realize that the setup scripts create the build directory default to your current directory, not relative to oe-core/poky? | 22:27 |
| * kergoth shrugs | 22:27 | |
| fray | since by definition ~/.yoctorc is user specific | 22:27 |
| lpapp | the problem is related to local global configuration. | 22:27 |
| lpapp | disk space is just one of those ... | 22:27 |
| *** darknighte is now known as darknighte_znc | 22:27 | |
| lpapp | again, many projects managed it nicely... I am sure yocto can too. | 22:27 |
| lpapp | it is not a big deal, and fairly trivial concept IMHO. | 22:28 |
| fray | when creating a project you expect to reproduce, you would also need to backup not only the local.conf, but the 'global configuration' as well.. | 22:28 |
| b46258 | you say it's just one, and yet... what else do you want to put in there? :-) | 22:28 |
| lpapp | and it is not "unix/linux" way as someone raised earlier... that just did not make sense to me. | 22:28 |
| kergoth | It's really easy to forget you left that laying around. we defaulted to pulling in ~/.oe/ for mel and some users had weird things happening different from what the customers hit because they forgot they had a site.lconf lnaying around there :) | 22:28 |
| fray | kergoth, thats why we don't use that solution.. everything needed to reproduce a build is local to the build (project) directory.. | 22:29 |
| * kergoth nods | 22:29 | |
| fray | you can safely wipe the 'tmp', but everything else should be stored in your SCM | 22:29 |
| lpapp | b46258: see the faq for further ones. | 22:29 |
| lpapp | do not get stuck on one particular configuration when we are discussing a configuration architecture. | 22:29 |
| kergoth | The only things I could see bieng safe to set in such a file would be things like parallel make and the # of threads, but even that is really bound to the machine, not the user / home directory, so use of an nfs homedir across different hosts would cause problems | 22:30 |
| * kergoth wanders off | 22:30 | |
| lpapp | fray: you are not making any sense | 22:31 |
| lpapp | I already mentiond /etc and ~ several times. | 22:31 |
| lpapp | of course, both make sense with different scenarios. | 22:31 |
| lpapp | just one of those, different users can decide about different rm_work policies | 22:31 |
| b46258 | lpapp: I think you are confused. I am well aware that you are talking about configuration architecture. On the other hand, I don't think that's a particularly good way to solve the problem that led you to identify the lack of ~/.yoctorc as a problem. | 22:31 |
| fray | if you set variables outside of your build directory.. you have to store those in order to reproduce the build in the future.. | 22:31 |
| fray | this has nothing to do with rm_work, or the parallel build configurations.. | 22:31 |
| lpapp | it has exactly everything to do with configs. | 22:32 |
| fray | those three just happen to be ones that are believed to be safe to change | 22:32 |
| lpapp | what the user prefer. | 22:32 |
| lpapp | do you think git accidentally has config files? | 22:32 |
| lpapp | global, local, et cetera? | 22:32 |
| lpapp | just for joke? | 22:32 |
| fray | You aren't understanding me | 22:32 |
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| fray | mkdir my-project | 22:32 |
| fray | cd my-project | 22:32 |
| lpapp | correct, I am totally lost. | 22:32 |
| fray | git init | 22:32 |
| fray | ~/git/poky/oe-init-env build | 22:33 |
| fray | git add build | 22:33 |
| fray | git commit -s -m "initial commit" | 22:33 |
| fray | make changes from there forward.. | 22:33 |
| fray | you can add to your .gitignore the build/tmp (and other directories) as needed | 22:33 |
| lpapp | b46258: you are entitled to forget many open source projects solving this very problem the way I propose. | 22:33 |
| fray | you can then come back in two years.. and downloads the same poky version.. and reproduce the system | 22:33 |
| fray | once you run oe-init-build-env your project is now configured and set | 22:34 |
| lpapp | fray: I already wrote several times build and source folders are not persistent | 22:34 |
| lpapp | home and etc area are. | 22:34 |
| b46258 | I haven't forgotten them, I'm just thinking about the user. | 22:34 |
| lpapp | for configuration. | 22:34 |
| fray | at that point you make changes to your configuration, but any change has the chance of triggering full rebuilds if the change is determined to affect the distribution configuration | 22:34 |
| lpapp | b46258: I think, you do not, and that is the root cause of my issue. | 22:34 |
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| fray | lpapp, I disagree completely.. home and etc is not persistent.. but SCM controlled build folders are | 22:35 |
| * lpapp is stepping aside | 22:35 | |
| b46258 | lpapp: would you agree that running out of disk space like this is a problem? | 22:38 |
| lpapp | as I wrote several times, no. | 22:40 |
| lpapp | and actually, it is so totally annoying to spend this much time with fundamentally broken config stuff that I might just extend the config parser whatever language it is written in. | 22:40 |
| lpapp | and if nothing else, I can apply this patch on vanilla yocto. ;) | 22:41 |
| fray | there is nothing to 'extend' in the parser.. | 22:41 |
| fray | to read your magic ~/yocto.rc, go in and modify the base system configuration to load it | 22:42 |
| fray | edit meta/conf/bitbake.conf | 22:42 |
| fray | add at the top | 22:42 |
| fray | include ~/.yoctorc | 22:43 |
| fray | save that as your local patch and it'll likely work.. | 22:43 |
| fray | (I don't know off hand if '~' is resolved.. if not, that's easy to fix as well) | 22:43 |
| lpapp | sorry, but you are wrong. | 22:44 |
| lpapp | I will not edit anything at all | 22:44 |
| lpapp | nor will I require that from the end user. | 22:44 |
| fray | you just said you are going to edit the parser! | 22:44 |
| fray | A change to the 'parser' won't be accepted upstream.. | 22:44 |
| fray | a change to bitbake.conf or a similar existing file may be | 22:44 |
| lpapp | after my patch, the software should implicitly handle dedicated semi-global, and global files. | 22:44 |
| fray | that's what I just told you how to do | 22:45 |
| fray | bitbake -- the engine loads the local.conf, bblayers.conf and bitbake.conf file.. everything else happens based on those three | 22:45 |
| lpapp | which is what I call extending the parser, as in allow the parser to parse other files... | 22:46 |
| fray | so you need to add your 'global' inclusion into one of those three, only bitbake.conf isn't dynamically generated by the oe-init-build-env | 22:46 |
| lpapp | there is everything to extend around the parser. :) | 22:46 |
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| lpapp | initially, it could be optional, and let us see what feedback it would be getting later ... | 22:47 |
| fray | go for it.. I can tell you right now it won't be accepted as a change to bitbake by the community. | 22:47 |
| lpapp | luckily it does not matter ... ;-) | 22:48 |
| fray | I gave you a way to have a constructive conversation within the community, and modify a file that is reasonable | 22:48 |
| fray | actually it does matter | 22:48 |
| fray | If you change something that the community won't accept, you are forking the project.. and at that point you are on your own | 22:48 |
| fray | if you are willing to maintain your own fork, great go for it..... | 22:49 |
| lpapp | hmm, you have apparently never heard about dpatch, quilt, et cetera .... | 22:49 |
| fray | but if you want the advantage of the open source community you need to work with them | 22:49 |
| lpapp | oh, your opinion is THE open source community? | 22:49 |
| lpapp | and other open people's opinion cannot be open source community to work with? | 22:49 |
| fray | I'm talking -any- open source community | 22:49 |
| fray | if you fork, you are on your own for maintenance.. | 22:50 |
| fray | one patch is easy.. | 22:50 |
| fray | 100 patches is difficult | 22:50 |
| fray | 1000 patches is impossible | 22:50 |
| * lpapp is pointint to quilt and dpatch for reading for those who do not understand and talk about forks. | 22:50 | |
| lpapp | pointing* | 22:50 |
| fray | (btw using quilt and dpatch for forking more then a couple of patches isn't worth the pain.. use git and your own branch) | 22:51 |
| lpapp | besides, this is not the first scenario when irc guys were too harsh | 22:51 |
| lpapp | but when I brought the subject to the mailing list (i.e. more official form), people were on my side. | 22:51 |
| lpapp | that is just how unfortunately irc works... rude and harsh people for constructive feedback at times. | 22:51 |
| lpapp | do not think you can discourage me to bring it up there, and maybe even got accepted ... ;-) | 22:52 |
| fray | I'm going to be blunt.. the feedback was constructive for the first few messages.. then you ignored us.. and have been arguing ever since | 22:52 |
| lpapp | there is a huge difference between ignoring (what you did when you did not wanna read my posts), and disagreeing. | 22:52 |
| fray | At this point, I'm happy to encourage others to bring their feedback to us.. we've made a large number of improvements over feedback.. but not everything sent back to the community is going to be implemented for a variety of reasons | 22:52 |
| lpapp | I of course read all the posts, and title them as "makes no sense" to me. | 22:53 |
| fray | I see no "posts", only IRC messages | 22:53 |
| lpapp | that is not quite called ignoring .... | 22:53 |
| seebs | I've certainly encountered some pretty hostile IRC channels, but I've been pretty happy with #yocto. People are pretty patient with my occasional fussy days or silly questions. | 22:53 |
| fray | IRC is no different then a long running hallway conversation.. occasionally you need to summarize for people who weren't in the hallways when you staretd | 22:53 |
| lpapp | fray: it is very different .... | 22:54 |
| lpapp | you have the log to prepare ...... | 22:54 |
| lpapp | that makes a huuuuuge difference ... | 22:54 |
| lpapp | you cannot bring the time back in the hallway .... | 22:54 |
| fray | what log? I don't log IRC... I just have a couple of screen scroll back | 22:54 |
| fray | he beginning of this is long gone | 22:55 |
| lpapp | when you did not wanna read the message, it was only a few lines above you.... | 22:55 |
| lpapp | I can post the log if you do not believe me .... | 22:55 |
| fray | I told you I scrolled back and saw something about vim and couldn't figure out what you wanted.. | 22:55 |
| fray | I asked you to summarize.. easy.. | 22:55 |
| lpapp | also, you should probably consider logging stuff as that makes the world a lot better to place to live at .... | 22:56 |
| lpapp | this practical example proves that, too ...... | 22:56 |
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| lpapp | to live in* | 22:56 |
| fray | sorry, I'm not going to log IRC.. I have absolutely no reason to.. you are free to log whatever you want | 22:56 |
| lpapp | then you have no rights to ask for summarization if you do not care to help yourself .... | 22:57 |
| fray | (If I'd been logging IRC, I'd have gigabytes of useless logs by this point.. it's simply not worth it) | 22:57 |
| ant_home | lpapp, never ever go for discussions on #beagle irc channel for any reason ;) We aren't truly the bad guys after all ;) | 22:58 |
| lpapp | fray: but your idea does not make sense to me anyway.... | 22:59 |
| lpapp | conf file is not meant to be doing controling logic .... | 22:59 |
| fray | yes it is | 22:59 |
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| lpapp | like checking if a file exists, and include conditionally, et cetera .... | 22:59 |
| fray | in bitbake, the .conf files are used to load in everythign that is needed.. | 22:59 |
| fray | (for the global configuration space) | 22:59 |
| ndec | yeah.. i am literaly amazed by how nice this channel is. i don't know any other place that would offer such a great patience in similar quite cumbersome circonstances... congrats #yocto ;-) | 22:59 |
| lpapp | ndec: clearly, you have never visited qt and kde channels. :) | 23:00 |
| lpapp | I tried to help the project, and I got "complaining, trolling" | 23:00 |
| lpapp | just two of those... | 23:00 |
| fray | look at the meta/bitbake.conf.. search for 'require conf/' and 'include conf/' | 23:00 |
| lpapp | I do not frequently get those in other channels .... | 23:00 |
| fray | you will see it is dynamically looking for a variety of configuration files and loading them if they exist.. | 23:01 |
| fray | require says it must exist, or it's an error.. | 23:01 |
| fray | include says load it if it exists, otherwise ignore it | 23:01 |
| lpapp | fray: looks like another architectural pitfall to me ... | 23:01 |
| fray | feel free to redo the architecture | 23:01 |
| lpapp | well, for me config is config for a reason ... because a simple designer or even artist could use it without any programming skills, including scripting stuff... | 23:03 |
| lpapp | if you put logic into it other than just configuration, it is called a script in my book .... | 23:03 |
| fray | yes, there is plenty of scripting possible in the bitbake .conf file format | 23:04 |
| fray | and BTW you don't even have to name your .conf files, ending in .conf.. that is just a convention.. you could call them all bob if you wanted | 23:04 |
| lpapp | yeah, so it makes so much sense to call a script file conf by default ...... | 23:05 |
| * fray goes and renames everything to .script | 23:05 | |
| lpapp | so it is worse than I thought.... | 23:06 |
| * fray wonders if he should explain what the magic INHERIT variable does... and how the bbclasses can affect the global variable space | 23:06 | |
| lpapp | it is not about a broken conf stuff, but there is actually no config interface.... | 23:06 |
| lpapp | only scripting..... | 23:06 |
| lpapp | perhaps I should stop the conversation to avoid the further bad surprises for today ... :-) | 23:07 |
| lpapp | also, your worry about reproducability is void by the fact that, you cannot guarantee everyone builds with the same core numbers anyhow... | 23:10 |
| fray | if you are truely concerned about reproducable builds.. you don't change your paralell numbers.. | 23:11 |
| fray | we just know from autobuilder results that it's safe to do so | 23:12 |
| lpapp | which is very unreal expectation to put it mildly ... | 23:12 |
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| lpapp | also, I am not only not truly concerned, but it was you bringing that topic up ... | 23:12 |
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| lpapp | fwiw, meta/conf/local.conf did not work ... | 23:15 |
| fray | I said to edit meta/conf/bitbake.conf | 23:16 |
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| bluelightning | I may be repeating part of what is said above but if you don't want to edit what comes from the poky git repository you should not be touching bitbake.conf... | 23:19 |
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| fray | bluelightning ya, we're past that point.. | 23:19 |
| bluelightning | ok | 23:20 |
| fray | he's convinced he has to edit the parser.. I'm trying to explain that won't be accepted | 23:20 |
| bluelightning | I have skimmed over the scrollback | 23:20 |
| fray | lol | 23:20 |
| bluelightning | there's no question, we have a steep learning curve | 23:21 |
| bluelightning | but a lot of the way the system works is pretty well established and for pretty good reasons | 23:21 |
| mr_science | not so steep as all that... previous experience with classic helps, but the current docs are pretty damn good imho... | 23:22 |
| fray | diff --git a/meta/conf/bitbake.conf b/meta/conf/bitbake.conf | 23:22 |
| fray | index 62a3936..a496f0d 100644 | 23:22 |
| fray | --- a/meta/conf/bitbake.conf | 23:22 |
| fray | +++ b/meta/conf/bitbake.conf | 23:22 |
| fray | @@ -1,3 +1,5 @@ | 23:22 |
| fray | +include ${@os.getenv("HOME")}/.oerc.conf | 23:22 |
| fray | + | 23:22 |
| fray | there that works | 23:22 |
| fray | ~/.oerc.conf | 23:23 |
| * fray learned something new.. the file does need to end in .conf | 23:23 | |
| mr_science | i still don't know sh*t, but that doesn't stop me from cranking out the rpi builds | 23:23 |
| mr_science | that said, i do try to "conform" to the bbappend guidance, etc | 23:24 |
| bluelightning | mr_science: we've certainly tried to improve things, and will continue to do so | 23:24 |
| bluelightning | mr_science: thanks, I'll pass on your comment about the docs to scottrif :) | 23:24 |
| mr_science | overall, yocto/poky docs are quite a bit better than the old stuff | 23:25 |
| lpapp | fray: you may, but someone else said osmething different. | 23:25 |
| lpapp | 22:23 < mr_science> lpapp: i'd try poky/meta/con | 23:25 |
| lpapp | and we were discussing local.confs back then. | 23:25 |
| fray | what I posted before will work in -your- project's local.conf as well | 23:25 |
| kergoth | amazing what a difference it makes having actual technical writers. open source projects tend to de-emphasize the non-code work, to their detriment, really.. | 23:25 |
| lpapp | fray: I really do not need that complexity as an end user. | 23:25 |
| fray | so bitbake doesn't parse '~'.. so you need to use the HOME environment to get into your home directory | 23:26 |
| mr_science | yup | 23:26 |
| lpapp | fray: so, I will not actually do that. | 23:26 |
| * mr_science uses $HOME in bblayers.conf | 23:26 | |
| lpapp | because I think it makes no sense as an end user. | 23:26 |
| fray | so one line is more complex then you hacking on the parser.. ok.. go for it | 23:26 |
| * kergoth chuckles | 23:26 | |
| lpapp | fray: :( | 23:27 |
| lpapp | fray: you still have not bothered to read what I wrote. | 23:27 |
| lpapp | it is only you repeating the "parser code" | 23:27 |
| fray | fray: so, I will not actually do that. | 23:27 |
| lpapp | I clearly explained what I meant. | 23:27 |
| fray | because I think it makes no sense as an end user. | 23:27 |
| fray | yup, I read that | 23:27 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: you're viewing this as an application; it's not really that, it's a complex build system | 23:27 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: it does not really matter whether it is an application or build system | 23:27 |
| lpapp | it does not matter a bit. | 23:27 |
| seebs | I came in late and don't actually understand the goal. Is this just to have some kind of automatic inclusion of build settings that aren't in the build directory? If so, why? | 23:28 |
| lpapp | one thing matters for any kind of end user: how can I use the software with the least effort possible | 23:28 |
| fray | prior you said you were going to add another file to the parser (at a minimum).. the one line diff would prevent the change to the parser, and put it in the well known-global startup file for bitbake.. | 23:28 |
| fray | seebs, he wants a global configuration file | 23:28 |
| lpapp | seebs: read the log | 23:28 |
| lpapp | we will not repeat it for you. | 23:28 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: the least effort possible is following the quick start guide, which tells you where to put everything | 23:28 |
| lpapp | fray: no no | 23:28 |
| lpapp | I have not ever mentioned "at least one more file". | 23:29 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: 1) except that I read and I had no clue | 23:29 |
| seebs | Well, the thing is, lpapp. There's hundreds and hundreds of lines of discussion in the log. And I haven't got the motivation to re-read all of them to follow this. Simply put, I don't want anything right now, so I have low motivation to do things like page through hundreds of lines of discussion of something in order to find out even what's being discussed. | 23:29 |
| lpapp | 2) Obviously, making a crap workflow and then documenting it is a silly idea in general | 23:29 |
| fray | me summarizes.. you don't want to confgiure local.conf, since you view it as transient (intermitent in your words).. so you want a dot file in your home directory to set key things, like the process count, rm_work... stuff that won't affect the end result of the build | 23:30 |
| lpapp | seebs: ok, fair enough, but the consequence is that you cannot follow | 23:30 |
| lpapp | it is your decision. | 23:30 |
| lpapp | that is a false summarization .... | 23:30 |
| * fray offered 3 solutions, you said they were too complicated.. | 23:30 | |
| lpapp | I can advice you 600 solutions. | 23:30 |
| * fray read you wanted to change the parser, I said there is a simpler way.. and posted a patch.. | 23:30 | |
| bluelightning | lpapp: so, effectively telling people their project is crap is probably not the best way to get help | 23:30 |
| seebs | Well, yeah. That was my point, I guess. Since I'm currently happy with the state of things, I'm not inclined to put effort into finding out what's going on. I am fine with "I can't follow this discussion", because nothing's ever happened to make me think I need to follow it. | 23:30 |
| lpapp | the point is not the quantity, but *quality* | 23:30 |
| * fray avoids the intermediate discussion that went nowhere | 23:30 | |
| seebs | Which is indirectly intended as advice, I guess: If you want a change, you need to think about how to make other people also want this change. Otherwise, they will ignore it because they aren't interested. | 23:31 |
| lpapp | advise* | 23:31 |
| seebs | When I have wanted changes to bitbake, I've usually started by trying to persuade other people that these changes would make *their* lives better. | 23:31 |
| lpapp | seebs: you are stating the obvious. | 23:32 |
| seebs | Then people become interested in helping me make those changes happen, or making those changes happen without my involvement. | 23:32 |
| lpapp | and we went through all this. | 23:32 |
| lpapp | please do not play the smart guy, and that everyone else is silly | 23:32 |
| lpapp | and cannot realize the obvious. | 23:32 |
| lpapp | only you. | 23:32 |
| seebs | You may think it's obvious, but people generally act as though they don't know it. I mean, heck. I do all the time. | 23:32 |
| seebs | I have to consciously stop and think about how I am presenting my requests to people in order to present them effectively, otherwise I end up with things that no one is interested in, and nothing happens. | 23:33 |
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| lpapp | I got an agreement with at least 5-10 people before discussing it in here in the first place, and that was all mentioned. | 23:33 |
| lpapp | yet, my feedback was called "complain", and "trolling". | 23:33 |
| lpapp | that frankly bugged me. | 23:33 |
| lpapp | and demotivated me. | 23:33 |
| fray | the original request was following by complaining that turned into trolling.. | 23:33 |
| * lpapp is stopping it right now | 23:33 | |
| lpapp | good luck guys | 23:34 |
| fray | the original request was valid and people responded with valid ways of doing what you wanted | 23:34 |
| seebs | 'k. | 23:34 |
| lpapp | I think I need to mention this to Jeff. | 23:35 |
| lpapp | he is responsible for community management. | 23:35 |
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| lpapp | it is definitely not healthy to call users, and even the one putting effort into improving things "complaining" or "trolls". | 23:36 |
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| myopiate | Hi, is there a reason why ppc e300c3 (MPC8315rdb) is tuned for soft float? | 23:40 |
| * fray looks quickly.. | 23:40 | |
| seebs | I think most likely it's because you are a bad person and deserve only suffering. .. oh, wait. That's what causes pseudo failures. I think soft-float tunings are caused by the sins of your ancestors. | 23:41 |
| fray | or fsl's.. ;) | 23:41 |
| * lpapp has just read back and no one said a thank you for the proposal regardless whether it is technically accepted or not. | 23:41 | |
| fray | there are difference versions of the MPC8315rdb board.. | 23:41 |
| * lpapp does not feel feedback welcoming here. | 23:42 | |
| fray | many of them were the earlier e300c2 if I remember right | 23:42 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: I'm sorry you feel you have had a negative experience here, but you must understand that it is how you have responded sometimes to people's advice that rubs people up the wrong way, and as human beings they respond in kind... the situation escalates and everyone ends up being frustrated | 23:43 |
| seebs | fray's memory matches my vague recollection, the 8315rdb was a soft-float board at least sometimes. | 23:43 |
| fray | myopiate the other possibility is the e300c3 doesn't have a classic PPC floating point using but something unique.. or it could just be a bug in the tune-ppce300c3 file.. | 23:44 |
| seebs | I think there are also some cases where a configuration is cloned from a similar-ish configuration, and no one notices that it's now set wrong. | 23:44 |
| fray | ya, that wouldn't surprise me in this case.. | 23:44 |
| seebs | I think e300c3 should have standard floating point. *thinks* We had a bug report or query about this back in the WRL 3.x days or so, I think? | 23:44 |
| myopiate | I am rebuilding with hard float, wish me luck. | 23:45 |
| fray | looking at the latest oe-core, the e300c3 says it's soft-float.. | 23:45 |
| myopiate | e300c[1,2,3] manual says it has | 23:45 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: I am sorry for disagreeing with their workarounds. | 23:45 |
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| lpapp | bluelightning: nothing anyone can change about technical disagreement. | 23:45 |
| fray | if you change the configuration to hard float.. and can verify that the floating point unit is used and it's not trapping.. it should get fixed.. | 23:45 |
| fray | myopiate the e300c2 definitely does NOT have hardware floating point.. the c1 might have | 23:45 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: but note how I did not call anyone with any bad name because I thought they technically do not make any sense to me. | 23:45 |
| fray | the e300mc also has floating point | 23:46 |
| fray | http://www.freescale.com/files/32bit/doc/ref_manual/e300coreRM.pdf | 23:46 |
| fray | page 1-3 says e300c2 is soft-float, while page 1-4 says the e300c3 is hard-float | 23:46 |
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| lpapp | bluelightning: I do not even understand how pointing out an issue, and proposing something better can be "complaining" | 23:46 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: regardless whether it is the approved or declined way. | 23:46 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: I just simply do not understand how such a scenario can be evaluated as "complaining". | 23:47 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: not to even speak about calling this "trolling". | 23:47 |
| seebs | "2) Obviously, making a crap workflow and then documenting it is a silly idea in general" <-- calling something "crap" is usually regarded as complaining, outside some specialized fields. | 23:47 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: it's a little more nuanced than that... when you tell someone their design decisions are wrong (or even "crap") when they have spent considerable time working on them and proving them in the field, that is going to generate consternation | 23:47 |
| myopiate | fray, that manual says e300c3 does. (it also says c2 does not). | 23:48 |
| myopiate | fray, yes, recompiling things now. | 23:48 |
| fray | ya.. it's likely a bug then... | 23:48 |
| myopiate | I'll report my results. | 23:48 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: what should I say for things I think wrong... good, should I be a liar? | 23:48 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: or should I remain honest I was with my technical thoughts? | 23:48 |
| fray | if you can check the kernel though, make sure hte floating point emulation/trapping is disabled... if everything works (s[ecifically floating point).. then it was a bug in the current implementation | 23:48 |
| seebs | lpapp: I can't tell whether that is a rhetorical question or an actual request for information. | 23:48 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: in any case, how is a technical disagreement "complaining"? | 23:48 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: especially when even a proposal was done? | 23:49 |
| fray | when you call something 'crap', it's no longer technical | 23:49 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: note, how I did not get any thank you. | 23:49 |
| fray | you have no gone into an emotional argument | 23:49 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: only "complaining" and "trolling". | 23:49 |
| seebs | I don't really expect people to thank me, in general, unless I am doing them a personal favor. | 23:49 |
| fray | when you won't listen to proposed solutions (workaround, etc).. that borders on complaining.. | 23:49 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: feel free to suggest changes, but when we explain why things are the way they are, you might care to put more stock in the explanations than you have been doing rather than ignoring them | 23:50 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: there was no any ignoring | 23:50 |
| * lpapp is sad to see people here with bad faith | 23:50 | |
| lpapp | it is probably Jeff's responsibility to fix it | 23:50 |
| lpapp | I will need to pass this role on to him. | 23:50 |
| * fray doesn't work for Jeff | 23:50 | |
| lpapp | it is a Yocto channel. | 23:51 |
| fray | (in fact I don't think any of the people here work for Jeff) | 23:51 |
| seebs | So, again, was the "what should I say" thing a request for information, or a rhetorical device? | 23:51 |
| lpapp | if Jeff decides this channel does not represent the project mercifully, you can hardly say anything. | 23:51 |
| seebs | *thinks* | 23:51 |
| ant_home | lpapp, I used 'trolling' and no doubt I was right | 23:51 |
| fray | if Jeff decides that anyone is not wanted in this channel, he is free to do as he needs for the sake of the project.. | 23:51 |
| ant_home | it wasn't an offense, re-read all pls | 23:52 |
| fray | but of course Jeff answers to the Yocto Project community and board.. | 23:52 |
| seebs | lpapp, am I right to guess that English is not your first language? It occurs to me some of the communications problems here have to do with connotations of words, which are often hard for people to pick up. | 23:52 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: honestly, I have not had such hard times like here within this short while in any other irc channels lately in this amount. | 23:54 |
| lpapp | and not just me, I did not see feedback handled the way it was here today. | 23:54 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: and honestly, my reading about "feedback is welcome" in the documentation, and what I see here, is ... contradictory. | 23:55 |
| lpapp | but again, it is Jeff's responsibility to take up with this, and come up with proposals for solving this community issue. | 23:55 |
| bluelightning | it's not the feedback you provided, but the manner in which you provided it | 23:56 |
| lpapp | 21:26 < lpapp> I wonder why there is no ~/.yoctorc or concept. | 23:56 |
| lpapp | 21:26 < lpapp> the current establishment seems 1) Weird with linux culture 2) Not intuitive at first glance. | 23:57 |
| lpapp | 21:29 < lpapp> those are not exclusive .... | 23:57 |
| lpapp | 21:30 < lpapp> I spent 30-60 minutes with it | 23:57 |
| lpapp | 21:30 < lpapp> and I still have not got the faintest idea about where to put and what to avoid the GB hell. | 23:57 |
| lpapp | 21:36 < lpapp> can someone please give me a file path where I can put an "rm work" config that will be valid for any kinda build? | 23:57 |
| bluelightning | and walters responded to that | 23:57 |
| lpapp | 21:37 < lpapp> IMO, this should be one of the very first FAQ questions. | 23:57 |
| seebs | I don't know what "the GB hell" is. | 23:57 |
| lpapp | I honestly do not see any problem with "the manner in which you provided it" | 23:57 |
| lpapp | could you please point me that out? | 23:58 |
| seebs | lpapp, I think the issue showed up more in the pages of conversation since then, where you said a lot of things that, at least to most people I know, would come across as hostile or confrontational. | 23:58 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: ^ | 23:58 |
| lpapp | seebs: sorry, I will ignore you now | 23:58 |
| seebs | I noticed. | 23:58 |
| seebs | Since I asked two or three times for answers to questions which would have allowed me to answer your questions. | 23:59 |
| lpapp | you were not here when we discussed it, yet you are trying to chim in about something you do not know. | 23:59 |
| lpapp | it is now not productive, sorry. | 23:59 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: kergoth tried to tell you how he approached the same issue, you responded in all caps telling him you didn't want something he wasn't telling you to do | 23:59 |
| seebs | Uh. Remember what you said about logs? | 23:59 |
| seebs | I actually have all the logs. | 23:59 |
| seebs | I have the entire history of the channel, and I've watched this conversation, and I've seen you ask questions about how what you said might be interpreted or why people would be offended. | 23:59 |
| c00kiemon5ter | I also have the logs.. will they keep filling with this ? | 23:59 |
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