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| dzoe | Hi, is there any way to set PREFERRED_VERSION_udev in image's .bb file or the only way is to use local.conf (or some other .conf)? | 07:54 |
|---|---|---|
| bluelightning | morning all | 07:57 |
| bluelightning | dzoe: no, it has to be at the configuration level | 07:58 |
| dzoe | bluelightning: and for example at meta layer configuration level? | 07:58 |
| bluelightning | dzoe: it would typically be in your custom distro configuration | 07:58 |
| _frank_ | morning, bluelightning~ In yocto, many places used "d" variable, like "packages = d.getVar('PACKAGES', True)". | 08:00 |
| _frank_ | Then, where is "d" defined ? and when is it cleared ? | 08:00 |
| bluelightning | _frank_: indeed | 08:00 |
| bluelightning | _frank_: it's normally passed into most python functions, either implicitly (for python xyz() { }) or explicitly (def funcname(arg1, arg2, d): ...) | 08:01 |
| bluelightning | _frank_: you can find the class declaration for it in bitbake/lib/bb/data_smart.py | 08:02 |
| _frank_ | bluelightning: yeah, thanks for help ! | 08:03 |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #230 of nightly-ppc-lsb is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-ppc-lsb/builds/230 | 08:07 | |
| dzoe | Ah, so basically I just add distro policy in meta-mylayer/conf/distro - that's easy. | 08:10 |
| dzoe | bluelightning: thank you | 08:10 |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #231 of nightly-mips is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-mips/builds/231 | 08:27 | |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #242 of nightly-mips-lsb is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-mips-lsb/builds/242 | 08:29 | |
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| _frank_ | What does PACKAGE_INSTALL_ATTEMPTONLY mean ? attemptonly ?? | 08:48 |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #233 of nightly-x86 is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-x86/builds/233 | 09:07 | |
| eren | hi all | 09:26 |
| eren | today, I guess I will test the first hambedded linux image in ALIX board. I hope I will succeed in getting KISS modem working :) | 09:27 |
| bluelightning | _frank_: it's a mechanism for attempting to install recipes that are not hard requirements where installing them might not always be possible (due to unsatisfied dependencies or conflicts) | 09:34 |
| bluelightning | er, s/recipes/packages/ | 09:34 |
| _frank_ | bluelightning: Then, RRECOMMENDS_{PN} will be interpreted to this kind attempting packages ? | 09:42 |
| bluelightning | _frank_: no, that is handled separately by the package manager | 09:42 |
| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #228 of nightly-world is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-world/builds/228 | 09:42 | |
| bluelightning | _frank_: although in past versions for RPM I think recommends might have gone into there | 09:43 |
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| _frank_ | bluelightning: I wonder what will result in PACKAGE_INSTALL_ATTEMPTONLY ? | 09:44 |
| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #201 of nightly-fsl-arm-lsb is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-fsl-arm-lsb/builds/201 | 09:44 | |
| mckoan | good morning | 09:45 |
| _frank_ | As we know, IMAGE_INSTALL + "xxx" will go to PACKAGE_INSTALL | 09:45 |
| bluelightning | _frank_: "git grep PACKAGE_INSTALL_ATTEMPTONLY" is your friend ;) | 09:46 |
| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #227 of nightly-x86-64 is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-x86-64/builds/227 | 09:47 | |
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| _frank_ | bluelightning: Thanks! | 09:51 |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #233 of nightly-arm-lsb is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-arm-lsb/builds/233 | 11:10 | |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #229 of nightly-arm is complete: Failure [failed Running Sanity Tests Building Images_1 Building Toolchain Images Building Toolchain Images_1 Publishing Artifacts] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org:8011/builders/nightly-arm/builds/229 | 11:31 | |
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| panda84kde | hi bluelightning: you can close this one: https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4439 | 13:27 |
| yocti | Bug 4439: normal, Medium, 1.5, kergoth, ACCEPTED , devshell fails to open a new tmux session | 13:27 |
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| bluelightning | panda84kde: will do | 13:28 |
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| panda84kde | bluelightning: thanks for fixing it! :) | 13:29 |
| bluelightning | panda84kde: thank the patch submitter, I just tried it out :) | 13:29 |
| panda84kde | right... | 13:30 |
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| eren | ah, I need to try that as well | 13:46 |
| eren | I applied the workaround before | 13:46 |
| eren | let's see :) | 13:46 |
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| eren | bluelightning: there is another workaround for it, have you looked at it? | 13:50 |
| eren | cml1.bbclass | 13:50 |
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| eren | I am wondering why it was not committed | 13:50 |
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| bluelightning | eren: I have, but that changes the behaviour for all terminals; this is a tmux-specific problem and should be fixed by the patch I've pointed to | 14:02 |
| eren | oh ok | 14:03 |
| eren | I guess we can close the bug after 2 confirmation | 14:03 |
| bluelightning | eren: did the patch I pointed to work for you? | 14:03 |
| eren | bluelightning: yes | 14:03 |
| bluelightning | great :) | 14:03 |
| eren | I guess we will see it included in the next release cycle? | 14:03 |
| bluelightning | yes, I'll add it to paule/dylan-next now for testing | 14:04 |
| eren | okkie | 14:04 |
| bluelightning | (poky-contrib branch that is) | 14:04 |
| eren | bluelightning: is there a problem with git.yoctoproject.org btw? | 14:05 |
| eren | it's really slow for me | 14:06 |
| bluelightning | eren: hmm yes it does seem a bit slow for me too | 14:06 |
| eren | http://dpaste.com/1323160/ | 14:07 |
| eren | it seems that the bottleneck is level3 | 14:07 |
| eren | at least for me | 14:07 |
| eren | yeah, definitely there is a problem with level3 | 14:09 |
| bluelightning | eren: the 100% loss items are a bit of a concern... | 14:09 |
| eren | bluelightning: yeah, the output is from Turkey, our ISP's behind-the-wall filtering/spying device I guess :) | 14:10 |
| eren | I've tried from UK, linode: http://dpaste.com/1323165/ | 14:10 |
| bluelightning | eren: that's OK, in recent months we've discovered (to not much surprise) that most countries have pretty intensive "spying" programmes :) | 14:11 |
| eren | yeah :) | 14:11 |
| bluelightning | halstead: are you aware of any current problems affecting access to git.yoctoproject.org? | 14:12 |
| eren | bluelightning: it seems that it is throttling the bw | 14:14 |
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| eren | I get linux-yocto around 400 - 500 KB/s | 14:15 |
| eren | from UK / Linode | 14:15 |
| eren | s/get/clone/ | 14:17 |
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| lpapp | http://pastebin.com/EgU1s9Vt -> this is another regression in dylan? | 14:27 |
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| lpapp | I did not get such error messages with denzil. | 14:27 |
| rburton | lpapp: no aware of any fetcher checksum changes, but i'm not paying attention there. if you name your tarballs you need to use the names in the checksums, like the lines it gave you. | 14:29 |
| lpapp | the meta/recipes-kernel/... does not do that though. | 14:29 |
| rburton | linux-yocto uses git so that isn't checksumed | 14:31 |
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| lpapp | I see. OK, this was not a problem with denzil though. | 14:32 |
| rburton | maybe denzil didn't mandate the name, dunno. | 14:32 |
| lpapp | sorry? | 14:33 |
| rburton | maybe denzil fell back to the non-named checksum | 14:33 |
| lpapp | you mean, it did not mandate the presence of the checksum? | 14:33 |
| rburton | if you had a tarball you'd need a checksum | 14:33 |
| lpapp | as I said, it was not a problem for denzil. | 14:34 |
| lpapp | so it is likely a new "intrusive action". | 14:34 |
| rburton | well, it's more correct this way | 14:34 |
| rburton | anyway, easy to fix and naming the checksums is more expressive/accurate when you have multiple files | 14:35 |
| rburton | (if you don't, no need to name them generally) | 14:35 |
| lpapp | well, you usually have patches for the kernel in a bsp layer ... | 14:36 |
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| lpapp | seems the error does not go away if I manually insert those two lines into the kernel recipe. | 14:37 |
| rburton | true | 14:37 |
| rburton | then something Very Odd is happening, pastebin? | 14:37 |
| lpapp | the same error? | 14:37 |
| lpapp | perhaps I should delete the tarball before retry | 14:38 |
| rburton | no | 14:39 |
| rburton | pastebin the recipe please | 14:39 |
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| lpapp | actually, deleting the tarball helped. | 14:40 |
| rburton | i can't see any reason for that | 14:40 |
| rburton | but i'm not going to argue it! :) | 14:40 |
| lpapp | weird, it came up again, just much later. | 14:42 |
| rburton | it was probably downloading the tarball | 14:42 |
| rburton | it will do many things in parallel | 14:42 |
| rburton | pastebin the latest error and your recipe | 14:42 |
| rburton | (with a dep chain of a->b->c, whilst a is still building bitbake will extract and patch b and c) | 14:43 |
| lpapp | http://pastebin.com/N9Z0pAh3 | 14:43 |
| lpapp | no, it was not. | 14:43 |
| lpapp | according to bitbake, that went fine ("fetch"). | 14:44 |
| lpapp | and it was doing some other jobs. | 14:44 |
| rburton | can you pastebin the recipe too? | 14:45 |
| lpapp | hmm, so kernel.md5sum != tarball.md5sum | 14:45 |
| lpapp | sorry, no. | 14:45 |
| rburton | correct | 14:45 |
| rburton | your SRC_URI has name=kernel | 14:46 |
| lpapp | I do not think it should be this complicated. | 14:46 |
| rburton | so you need a checksum called kernel.md5sum | 14:46 |
| lpapp | it does not matter whether it is the kernel or something else. | 14:46 |
| rburton | this is generic bitbake checksumming | 14:46 |
| lpapp | the checksum should be standardized how it is expressed in bitbake. | 14:46 |
| rburton | it is | 14:46 |
| lpapp | might be generic, but whether it is good. | 14:46 |
| lpapp | that is questionable. | 14:46 |
| lpapp | here is the example at hand. | 14:46 |
| rburton | SRC_URI[optional-name.md5sum] | 14:46 |
| rburton | you may have multiple tarballs, so you need a way to identify them | 14:47 |
| rburton | the naming is entirely up to you | 14:47 |
| lpapp | too much flexibility for no apparent gain. | 14:47 |
| lpapp | most people will not change the order, so that could be the common denominator. | 14:48 |
| lpapp | 1: gcc-cross-4.7.2-r20 do_compile (pid 10855) | 14:48 |
| lpapp | ??? | 14:48 |
| lpapp | why is it building that? | 14:49 |
| lpapp | I explicitly have an external toolchain! | 14:49 |
| rburton | didn't you have that problem earlier? some dependency the external toolchain wasn't providing, iirc. | 14:49 |
| lpapp | no, I did not. | 14:50 |
| rburton | "bitbake -g -u depexp" should let you see what is pulling it in | 14:50 |
| rburton | then you can work out why | 14:50 |
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| lpapp | WARNING: linux-foo: No generic license file exists for: GPL in any provider | 14:52 |
| lpapp | that seems to be a new change with dylan as well... | 14:53 |
| lpapp | not sure I understand the warning. | 14:53 |
| rburton | you need to version "GPL" | 14:54 |
| rburton | ie "GPLv2" | 14:54 |
| rburton | there wasn't a "GPL" in denzil either from what I can tell | 14:55 |
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| lpapp | not sure what that means. | 14:57 |
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| rburton | using License="GPL" in denzil was likely to produce a warning, from what i can see | 14:58 |
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| rburton | the kernel is v2, so you need to say GPLv2 | 14:58 |
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| rburton | very important as i'm sure you're aware, you don't want to accidently use any GPLv3 code if that concerns you | 14:59 |
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| *** Song is now known as Song_Liu | 14:59 | |
| scottrif | YPTM: Scott Rifenbark is on the call | 15:00 |
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| lpapp | http://pastebin.com/FkAz7uik -> yet another dylan warning/error? | 15:00 |
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| Song_Liu | YPTM: Welcome to the tech team meeting, please let me know who's on the bridge. Thanks! | 15:01 |
| tomz2 | YPTM: Tom Z on | 15:01 |
| bluelightning | YPTM: Paul Eggleton joined | 15:01 |
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| jzhang-laptop | YPTM: jzhang's on the call | 15:01 |
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| fray | YPTM: I'm here | 15:01 |
| dvhart | YPTM: Darren is on | 15:01 |
| rburton | lpapp: does the stock busybox build? might be your recipe using internal functions that got removed. | 15:02 |
| darknighte | YPTM: Song, Sean is here. | 15:02 |
| * darknighte waves | 15:02 | |
| rburton | YPTM: ross here | 15:02 |
| nitink | YPTM: Nitin is on the bridge | 15:02 |
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| sgw_ | YPTM: Dial-in number: 1.972.995.7777 / Participant passcode: 42001078 | 15:03 |
| sgw_ | YPTM: Saul is on | 15:03 |
| Song_Liu | YPTM: Any opens? | 15:03 |
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| laur | YPTM: LaurentiuP joined | 15:03 |
| halstead | YPTM: Michael here. | 15:04 |
| darknighte | YPTM: Song_Liu: a reminder: there is a OE project IRC discussion in the next hour. | 15:04 |
| eren | oh | 15:04 |
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| * eren connecting | 15:04 | |
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| cristianiorga | YPTM: Cristian is present | 15:05 |
| zeddii | YPTM: Bruce Ashfield in on. | 15:06 |
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| eren | YPTM: Eren is present | 15:06 |
| halstead | bluelightning, Is git.yp.org still slow for you? | 15:06 |
| BSDCat | YPTM: Matthew Weigel just joined | 15:06 |
| pidge | YPTM: Beth joined | 15:07 |
| bluelightning | halstead: a little bit, but eren was having some more serious difficulties | 15:07 |
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| eren | halstead: yeah, I cloned linux-yocto at the rate of ~400 KB/s | 15:08 |
| eren | I cloned, no problem for me but I'm wondering why it was that slow | 15:09 |
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| halstead | eren, We have been near our bandwidth cap (60mbps) recently. http://is.gd/aSumhe | 15:10 |
| eren | halstead: oh, assuming that that's a bw problem then? | 15:11 |
| rburton | halstead: whoa, what was that spike? :) | 15:11 |
| halstead | rburton, The large spike going over the cap at 20:00 is a backup to a network peer. That's why it can go so high. | 15:12 |
| rburton | ah | 15:12 |
| halstead | rburton, That transit really should be excluded from the graph but it isn't. | 15:13 |
| rburton | i need me some of that capacity here | 15:13 |
| halstead | That would be nice. :) | 15:13 |
| eren | halstead: do you use munin for network graph? | 15:14 |
| eren | sorry for off-topic question :) | 15:14 |
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| eren | any link for "making of?" | 15:16 |
| halstead | eren, No. Just using our ISP's graphs right now. | 15:16 |
| eren | halstead: okkie, thanks. | 15:16 |
| AlexG | is Beth around? | 15:17 |
| sgw_ | AlexG: beth is pidge | 15:17 |
| darknighte | dvhart: woot on getting so much into the maintainer trees. | 15:17 |
| AlexG | sgw_: tnx | 15:17 |
| halstead | eren, Link to "making of" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qbr9QYFmzrU&feature=player_embedded | 15:17 |
| eren | halstead: thanks | 15:19 |
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| darknighte | halstead: vacation!?! who authorized that? | 15:20 |
| zeddii | +1 | 15:20 |
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| halstead | darknighte, Some crazy LF person. | 15:21 |
| darknighte | halstead: Hope you have a great time and manage to forget about work (for the most part) for a while. | 15:22 |
| halstead | darknighte, Thanks. I'll go out on southern Oregon whitewater for a bit and then see a play or three in Ashland OR. Should be fun. | 15:24 |
| eren | github.com/eren/meta-hamradio | 15:24 |
| darknighte | Sounds fun. | 15:24 |
| sgw_ | halstead: I am jealous about whitewater! | 15:24 |
| darknighte | halstead: sgw_: I have never gone on whitewater. | 15:25 |
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| darknighte | halstead: aren't there different levels? | 15:25 |
| pidge | eren: I need to get my station back up soon :) Then I can start testing! | 15:25 |
| eren | pidge: oh okkie! :) | 15:26 |
| eren | thanks | 15:26 |
| pidge | eren: antenna mast collapsed | 15:26 |
| darknighte | it sounds like pidge likes to brutalize her keyboard… | 15:27 |
| eren | pidge: oh :/ sad. | 15:27 |
| eren | pidge: only aprs support is there, btw. | 15:27 |
| halstead | darknighte, Each series of rapids is rated 1-6. I've done up to 4. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rafting#Grades_of_white_water) | 15:27 |
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| eren | I'm also working on ALIX 3D3 support, so it will be a little complicated :) | 15:28 |
| eren | I will see if it boots and try to interface it with KISS modem | 15:28 |
| pidge | eren: I had grig support working a while back. | 15:28 |
| Song_Liu | YPTM: thank you all for joining the meeting, have nice day or evening! | 15:29 |
| pidge | darknighte: my keyboard is loud | 15:29 |
| pidge | brb | 15:29 |
| darknighte | halstead: so, going for a grade 6? | 15:29 |
| sgw_ | khem, did you disappear the 2.18 eglibc tarball, do we need to recreate that on the downloads.yp.org? | 15:29 |
| darknighte | halstead: I like the description on wikipedia... | 15:29 |
| kergoth | damn. i was hoping to use this native systemd-tmpfiles to prepopulate tmpfiles.d, but it can't e built on rhel5/centos5, which is where we still do most of our builds | 15:30 |
| * kergoth grumbles | 15:30 | |
| darknighte | halstead: "Skill level: successful completion of a Class 6 rapid without serious injury or death is widely considered to be a matter of great luck or extreme skill and is considered by some as a suicidal venture" | 15:30 |
| halstead | darknighte, I'll probably stick with the easy ones as I'm a bit rusty. | 15:30 |
| sgw_ | halstead: the rouge? on your own or with a guide? | 15:31 |
| darknighte | halstead: that sounds prudent to me. it sounds like great fun no matter what class. | 15:31 |
| eren | hehe, these boards are literally "cooked" (minnowboard) | 15:33 |
| halstead | sgw_, With a guide company. Probably a half day on the upper klamath and a full day on the rogue. | 15:34 |
| sgw_ | halstead: nice, we did a family trip a couple of years ago on the rogue, was blast, I actually kayaked a bunch of it (but not the bigger stuff) | 15:37 |
| dvhart | darknighte, thanks :) | 15:39 |
| halstead | sgw_, When I was 19 I did a five day trip on the rogue with a paddle boat, an oar boat for gear, and two IKs. It was a good trip with a lot of downtime. | 15:39 |
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| sgw_ | bluelightning: do you have the external-sourcery patch in your dylan queue? | 15:48 |
| bluelightning | sgw_: I can add it definitely | 15:49 |
| sgw_ | bluelightning: do you want me to leave bug 4908 open for dylan now, probably should take that, I will mark you owner also. | 15:49 |
| yocti | Bug https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4908 normal, Medium+, 1.5 M3, saul.wold, IN PROGRESS REVIEW , External toolchain does not work with poky dylan | 15:49 |
| bluelightning | sgw_: yes let's keep it open until the patch is merged in dylan | 15:50 |
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| lpapp | kergoth: ^ | 15:51 |
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| lpapp | rburton: I have the busybox version from danny | 16:04 |
| lpapp | which is not working with dylan apparently ... | 16:04 |
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| lpapp | this change broke it from RP: http://bpaste.net/show/118688/ | 16:04 |
| rburton | lpapp: why are you using danny's busybox with dylan? | 16:04 |
| lpapp | rburton: because dylan's busybox does not work. | 16:05 |
| lpapp | also, we have custom patches | 16:05 |
| rburton | it does work, what's your specific problem? i recommend applying your patches in a bbappend instead of taking a recipe from another version and amending that. | 16:06 |
| lpapp | is there a way for sending patches to the mailing list without subscriving and moderation? | 16:06 |
| lpapp | it is getting tedious. | 16:06 |
| rburton | you can subscribe and turn off mail delivery | 16:06 |
| rburton | then you don't get moderated but you don't get list mail | 16:06 |
| lpapp | rburton: no no | 16:06 |
| lpapp | rburton: our busybox is quite different. | 16:07 |
| lpapp | with changes, very unlikely for upstreaming. | 16:07 |
| lpapp | and they are intrusive. | 16:07 |
| lpapp | .bbappend will not help you there. | 16:07 |
| rburton | fine, so fork the one native to your release | 16:07 |
| lpapp | rburton: that leaves me stale in a few years. | 16:08 |
| lpapp | on many mailing lists, then... i.e. not a preferred option. | 16:08 |
| lpapp | rburton: it was already forked back then. | 16:08 |
| lpapp | so, can anyone explian RP's change? | 16:08 |
| lpapp | I do not quite get it from the commit message. | 16:09 |
| lpapp | nor that, what I am supposed to do afterwards ... | 16:09 |
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| lpapp | so basically, Yocto does not provide API guarantee. | 16:10 |
| lpapp | source code interface can break at any moment. | 16:11 |
| lpapp | so basically forking is an unpleasure experience then ... | 16:11 |
| lpapp | because the Yocto API is inherently unstable. | 16:12 |
| lpapp | no guarantees. | 16:12 |
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| rburton | lpapp: that commit make the file deps handling be threaded, and it shouldn't have broken your recipe | 16:13 |
| lpapp | rburton: process_deps is not available anymore after that commit ... | 16:14 |
| lpapp | as you can see it was moved around ... | 16:14 |
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| lpapp | sounds like a bugzilla entry for documenting the no api compatibility promise. | 16:15 |
| lpapp | NameError: global name 'process_deps' is not defined | 16:15 |
| rburton | lpapp: i still recommend forking the busybox recipe in the version of your distro, instead of attempting to use one from an older release | 16:15 |
| lpapp | after that particular change ... | 16:15 |
| lpapp | rburton: you are not real. | 16:16 |
| lpapp | rburton: causing extra work for us is not wished. | 16:16 |
| lpapp | rebase all the stuff, test all the utils thoroughly, etc. | 16:16 |
| rburton | lpapp: if you pastebin the recipe i may be able to help you solve your parsing problems | 16:16 |
| lpapp | rburton: recipe was already pasted. | 16:16 |
| rburton | or if you just have patches, use a bbappend. | 16:16 |
| lpapp | but it upstream danny, really. | 16:16 |
| rburton | lpapp: sorry i'm also in meetings and trying to do work, must have missed it | 16:17 |
| lpapp | as I said before, .bbappend is a complete no go | 16:17 |
| lpapp | please read back why I claimed that. | 16:17 |
| rburton | i did, and i don't understand | 16:17 |
| lpapp | read harder. :) | 16:18 |
| lpapp | also, after the mailing list incident about fixing a serious regression, I do not wish to do any upgrade to busybox | 16:18 |
| lpapp | it is fully broken, and should not be used for my project | 16:18 |
| lpapp | you will have more work in the end with the support than accepting, but I was trying to be clear about it. | 16:19 |
| lpapp | I have to maintain old stuff, you need to support more. | 16:19 |
| lpapp | it is a lost/lost for everyone involved except a very few people, if any! | 16:19 |
| lpapp | https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4958 | 16:23 |
| yocti | Bug 4958: normal, Undecided, ---, scott.m.rifenbark, NEW , No documentation about source compatibility | 16:23 |
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| bluelightning | lpapp: help harder... | 16:24 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: ? | 16:24 |
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| bluelightning | you want rburton to help you, so help him to do so by explaining yourself clearly | 16:25 |
| bluelightning | please | 16:25 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: what to explain, please? | 16:25 |
| lpapp | there are more specific questions than "I do not understand". | 16:26 |
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| bluelightning | lpapp: please explain why a bbappend won't work for you because that is the mechanism we recommend for adding a few patches/supplying a different config to a recipe such as busybox | 16:27 |
| lpapp | I already did | 16:27 |
| lpapp | besides, no, you have actually suggested a *fork* for patches that will not be upstreamed. | 16:28 |
| bluelightning | nothing about bbappends mandates sending patches upstream | 16:28 |
| lpapp | and even .bbappend would not fly really, as it does not solve the main problem at hand: avoid the additional rebase and relevant works because someone thought it is good to break source compatibility. | 16:29 |
| rburton | that's exactly what a bbappend is designed to solve | 16:29 |
| lpapp | not really, no. | 16:29 |
| lpapp | it needs *manual* work to rebase changes, a lot, like this discussion. | 16:29 |
| * lpapp wonders why he needs to fight for trivial things, like so many others fork packages out there, and now being pointed as evil | 16:30 | |
| lpapp | it is the same as the defense of the almost non-existing rfkill users. | 16:30 |
| lpapp | I am bored with fighting for trivial stuff. | 16:30 |
| rburton | we're not stopping you fork, but it's your problem when the fork needs rebasing | 16:31 |
| rburton | which is what bbappend is designed to do, you can change sources/add patches/add functions and not care when the "real" recipe is updated | 16:31 |
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| lpapp | the fork does not need any rebasing. | 16:31 |
| lpapp | that is the whole point of the fork. | 16:31 |
| lpapp | the upstream source version can be retained easily. | 16:32 |
| lpapp | I am coming here for help, not to get more work on my shoulder. | 16:33 |
| lpapp | RP: you broke the stuff, any clue what to change in the fork? | 16:33 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: this is a rare instance where a recipe was broken because it called internal functions in package.bbclass, this is not a common case | 16:33 |
| davest | lpapp: the community is happy to offer advice, but remember we all have work to do. You need to do work too. :-) | 16:34 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: if you prefer not to use a bbappend and rebase your patches each release, I'd suggest to resolve this particular issue, just use the current inc file | 16:34 |
| lpapp | davest: ? | 16:34 |
| lpapp | I have been doing simple yocto stuff for two weeks soon | 16:34 |
| lpapp | to get something basic done? | 16:34 |
| lpapp | in full time | 16:34 |
| lpapp | with an already well-innovated system into Yocto. | 16:34 |
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| lpapp | bluelightning: that might bring new dependencies in, not present in other places... | 16:35 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: which can launch an avalanche. | 16:35 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: what would you like us to do, then? | 16:35 |
| lpapp | I would rather wait for an expert feedback, basically RP who broke it. | 16:35 |
| bluelightning | RP is on holiday, you may be waiting some time | 16:36 |
| davest | lpapp: perhaps you might be better served by someone like Wind River or Mentor who you can get paid support from. | 16:36 |
| lpapp | and no one else knows why he broke it? | 16:36 |
| lpapp | like reviewers who approved? | 16:36 |
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| lpapp | davest: oh, yeah, that is so cheap | 16:36 |
| lpapp | but if you pay, well, why not? :) | 16:36 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: at the time he made the change, FYI, the inc file no longer had a reference to the function | 16:36 |
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| davest | lpapp: I observe a definite fatigue factor on the community's part | 16:37 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: yes, I checked. | 16:37 |
| lpapp | bluelightning: but that does not mean, he did not break the API | 16:37 |
| rburton | lpapp: you're assuming it was stable API to begin with. i'm not sure where that was documented. | 16:37 |
| lpapp | davest: well, if Yocto is fatigue, that might be right. :) | 16:37 |
| lpapp | davest: we are all here to improve it to be less tiring. | 16:38 |
| lpapp | i.e. proper errors, etc | 16:38 |
| rburton | lpapp: so the change was good, as busybox was fixed before the change was made. | 16:38 |
| lpapp | rburton: as I wrote just a few lines above, it broke the API for other people. | 16:38 |
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| lpapp | rburton: yes, of course, I assumed Yocto provides stable stuff | 16:38 |
| lpapp | pardon me. | 16:38 |
| lpapp | see my bugreport for action points. | 16:38 |
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| lpapp | is the busybox.inc supposed to work with older busybox releases as is? | 16:40 |
| rburton | it's not designed to be generic for all time, no | 16:41 |
| lpapp | :'( | 16:41 |
| rburton | but if you've a compatible busybox its a big fragment you can include and then tweak from your .bb | 16:41 |
| lpapp | so basically if you are coming from one older release (~6 month), you might be screwed. | 16:42 |
| rburton | there's a spectrum of ways to change a package | 16:42 |
| rburton | fork the .bb / use a common .inc / use a bbappend | 16:43 |
| lpapp | sounds like a call for a public discussion | 16:43 |
| lpapp | to actually deprecate stuff maximum, but not break. | 16:43 |
| rburton | deprecate implies remove | 16:43 |
| davest | lpapp: I think what you are suggesting would be impossible to validate | 16:43 |
| lpapp | rburton: in the future. So? | 16:44 |
| lpapp | davest: no idea what you are saying. | 16:44 |
| davest | "is the busybox.inc supposed to work with older busybox releases as is?" | 16:44 |
| davest | That would be impossible to validate | 16:44 |
| lpapp | sure, it would be possible. | 16:45 |
| davest | Not with bounded resources of an open source project | 16:45 |
| lpapp | go back a few releases, but at least two (~1 year) | 16:45 |
| davest | remember, you are not paying money for this work | 16:45 |
| lpapp | davest: it really has nothing to do with that. | 16:45 |
| lpapp | it could be all automated, really. | 16:45 |
| lpapp | it is a machine work, not human. | 16:45 |
| davest | Again, takes work to do that | 16:45 |
| Jefro | for every supported board? | 16:45 |
| davest | do you want to volunteer to do it? | 16:46 |
| lpapp | Jefro: of course no, just the supported toolchains etc ... which are still undocumented... | 16:46 |
| lpapp | see my bugreport for details. | 16:46 |
| lpapp | let us see who approved that break. | 16:47 |
| lpapp | so, it could be that one release (~6 months) back is verified against the change with the supported combinations, and then the information could also be used for writing the porting guide. | 16:49 |
| lpapp | if something breaks, at least a porting guide could help. | 16:49 |
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| rburton | the release notes have an upgrading section, but sadly humans are involved so stuff gets missed | 16:50 |
| lpapp | rburton: how would you know something breaks if you do not have CI? | 16:51 |
| lpapp | you would have much less power to know. | 16:51 |
| lpapp | so, I think the first step ahead could be testing one version back with CI | 16:51 |
| lpapp | and that could also give some continuity between releases. | 16:51 |
| lpapp | so one person coming from 2 or 3 versions back can still follow the progress. | 16:52 |
| lpapp | note, even if I decided to upgrade to the latest busybox, dylan would still be broken | 16:52 |
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| lpapp | as my change was rejected | 16:52 |
| lpapp | so I do not even bother to get twice more work. | 16:52 |
| davest | lpapp: believe this does go beyond what we're able to do, unless you feel inspired to volunteer. | 16:52 |
| davest | lpapp: as I said, you can always work with an OSV | 16:53 |
| lpapp | well, it is not my problem, only. | 16:53 |
| lpapp | it is also your, and your users' problem. | 16:53 |
| lpapp | it would be a generic quality and documentation gate. | 16:54 |
| davest | lpapp: we try to be responsive if there is a strong demand | 16:54 |
| davest | lpapp: but remember, it's still free software | 16:54 |
| Jefro | I think the issue is that lpapp is trying to do things outside of what we normally test for. We can only build & test for a finite number of combinations of things, so we try to meet as many combinations as we can. I can also see his point, that there are things that "should" work - while we welcome contributions to help get those things working, there is only so much one team can do. | 16:55 |
| lpapp | it is not possible to search on patchwork for an sha? o_O | 16:55 |
| lpapp | Jefro: no no | 16:56 |
| Jefro | not correct? | 16:56 |
| lpapp | Jefro: it would be equivalently broken for any supported combination with one release back. | 16:56 |
| lpapp | regardless toolchain, machine, distro, whatsoever. | 16:56 |
| lpapp | a python function got moved around. It is platform agnostic stuff. | 16:56 |
| lpapp | Jefro: I do not think you will give CI access for me. | 16:57 |
| lpapp | so inherently, I cannot help. | 16:57 |
| davest | lpapp: if you are suggesting we validate one version back for all recipes to make sure they still function, that is not sensible | 16:57 |
| davest | lpapp: excuse me | 16:57 |
| davest | lpapp: I meant to say | 16:57 |
| davest | lpapp: creating a working operating system is a tricky thing | 16:58 |
| davest | lpapp: you need to get everything just right to make it work | 16:58 |
| davest | lpapp: it's not easy, believe me | 16:58 |
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| lpapp | davest: easy or not, it would make a lot of sense IMO... ;-) | 16:58 |
| davest | lpapp: and YP is so flexible and the universe of possible combinations so large | 16:59 |
| davest | lpapp: I just don't see how an open source community project could do better | 16:59 |
| lpapp | well, you will not give access for me to the CI, will you | 16:59 |
| davest | lpapp: but we really do try to do better, all the time | 16:59 |
| lpapp | if you do not, you cannot say, I should help because I am physically unable. :) | 17:00 |
| davest | lpapp: well, anything is possible | 17:00 |
| lpapp | yeah, right ... :) | 17:01 |
| davest | lpapp: honestly though, I would want to meet with you first | 17:01 |
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| lpapp | https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4958 -> anyway, this can be a starting step, and probably not hard to resolve. | 17:01 |
| yocti | Bug 4958: normal, Undecided, ---, scott.m.rifenbark, NEW , No documentation about source compatibility | 17:01 |
| lpapp | "it can eat babies, period" | 17:01 |
| lpapp | and then I will try to do my best to avoid forks. | 17:02 |
| lpapp | I would not mind updating my busybox to dylan if my patch had got approved, and hence had had one less pain. | 17:04 |
| lpapp | but that is just a hindsight. | 17:04 |
| lpapp | and I even made the contribution there. ;) | 17:04 |
| lpapp | why are white space changes allowed? :O | 17:06 |
| lpapp | I mean 4 or 8 spaces. | 17:06 |
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| lpapp | does it really matter? | 17:06 |
| lpapp | I see a lot of noise like that in dylan. | 17:06 |
| davest | lpapp: there is something about Python compatibility | 17:06 |
| lpapp | davest: elaborate? | 17:06 |
| davest | lpapp: can't, I have never programmed in Python before | 17:07 |
| davest | lpapp: are you a Python expert? | 17:07 |
| lpapp | no | 17:07 |
| davest | lpapp: just take my word for it | 17:08 |
| lpapp | but surely, python accepts both... | 17:08 |
| lpapp | so modifying it for no real gain is bad. | 17:08 |
| lpapp | since it causes a lot of noise. | 17:08 |
| davest | lpapp: possibly, but please don't call me shirley | 17:08 |
| lpapp | heh, fun, and actually these are even tabs! | 17:08 |
| lpapp | I thought dylan would have eliminated tabs? | 17:09 |
| hollisb | lpapp: http://python3porting.com/differences.html#indentation | 17:09 |
| lpapp | davest: will not as I do not even know what a shirley is. ;) | 17:09 |
| lpapp | hollisb: what are you trying to represent | 17:10 |
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| lpapp | present* | 17:10 |
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| hollisb | lpapp: I'm trying to answer your question about whitespace changes and why it matters | 17:11 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: a mix of tabs and spaces makes it hard to match things up between bbclasses, recipes that inherit from them, and bbappends | 17:11 |
| lpapp | hollisb: that does not answer it though. | 17:11 |
| lpapp | hollisb: the style is already mixed. | 17:11 |
| hollisb | ok then, carry on | 17:11 |
| lpapp | hollisb: and dylan was previously complaining about tabs when coming from denzil. | 17:11 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: and python mandates that you match them up from line to line within the same function, which in our system may be split across multiple files | 17:12 |
| lpapp | but what I see in meta/recipes-core/busybox/busybox.inc is the introduction of tabs | 17:12 |
| bluelightning | lpapp: in a python function or a shell function? | 17:13 |
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| lpapp | bluelightning: busybox.inc | 17:14 |
| lpapp | python | 17:14 |
| lpapp | and also shell. | 17:14 |
| lpapp | just compare from danny to dylan | 17:14 |
| lpapp | it is a LOT of noise. | 17:15 |
| lpapp | it can hardly integrate them because of the noise. | 17:15 |
| lpapp | I can* | 17:15 |
| lpapp | maybe you have some whitespace ignoring diff program, but that is about vimdiff. | 17:15 |
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| lpapp | -> install: cannot stat `/home/lpapp/Projects/Yocto/poky-dylan-9.0.1/build/tmp/work/armv5te-foo-linux-gnueabi/busybox/1.20.2-r0/busybox-cron': No such file or directory | 17:18 |
| lpapp | after copying the new busybox.inc over. | 17:18 |
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| lpapp | how can I fix that? | 17:22 |
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| bluelightning | lpapp: probably, you'll need to adapt it to things that are not present in the version of busybox that you are building | 17:24 |
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| lpapp | that is a lot of work, yeah. | 17:25 |
| bluelightning | I wouldn't have thought it to be that much | 17:26 |
| * bluelightning needs to head off, back later | 17:26 | |
| lpapp | well, you cannot solve it with clean vanilla. | 17:27 |
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| lpapp | is there a version freeze period for packages to be updated? | 17:29 |
| lpapp | i.e. can I just go ahead and submit u-boot, busybox, etc upgrades I made locally to oe-core? | 17:29 |
| davest | lpapp: there is a cycle for these things, yes | 17:30 |
| davest | lpapp: stick on the technical call and you will get a sense for how it works | 17:30 |
| davest | lpapp: you can submit patches of course but depending on the time frame it might not get applied to Master until after the release | 17:31 |
| davest | We're finishing up M3 now, so there is still a window | 17:32 |
| lpapp | I do not know anything about a technical call | 17:32 |
| lpapp | i.e. I even opened a bugreport about that to be more open. | 17:32 |
| lpapp | but I might be off there. | 17:32 |
| sgw_ | davest: lpapp: window for M3 is closed, M4 and beyond is open | 17:32 |
| davest | lpapp: ? | 17:32 |
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| davest | lpapp: the call is announced on yocto@yoctoproject.org | 17:32 |
| lpapp | davest: well, it seems to be regular. | 17:33 |
| lpapp | other projects document the time, place, etc on the webpage. | 17:33 |
| lpapp | not on a mailing list out of the many. | 17:33 |
| sgw_ | lpapp: the number is also posted in the chat room. | 17:33 |
| davest | lpapp: this is the way we do it | 17:33 |
| lpapp | davest: which I suggest to change. | 17:33 |
| lpapp | last time when it started, I had no idea what was going on. | 17:34 |
| lpapp | and I did not wanna chim in because it seemed something official. | 17:34 |
| lpapp | I thought I would look for it on the website, but found noting. | 17:34 |
| davest | lpapp: it can take time to get used to the way a community works. | 17:34 |
| lpapp | nothing* | 17:34 |
| lpapp | so I had no any clue when I can start talking again, etc. | 17:34 |
| davest | lpapp: give it time, you'll figure it out | 17:34 |
| lpapp | davest: I do not wanna give time to everyone | 17:35 |
| lpapp | I wanna people getting involved as easily as possible. | 17:35 |
| lpapp | see other projects, how smoothly they managed. | 17:35 |
| davest | lpapp: suggest you join the mailing list. there is an agenda posted there | 17:36 |
| davest | lpapp: This is the way it works for us and has worked pretty smoothly | 17:37 |
| lpapp | davest: I just mentioned why it does not work smooth | 17:37 |
| lpapp | see, this is what I do not like here. :) | 17:37 |
| davest | lpapp: and I understand | 17:37 |
| lpapp | trying to improve stuff, and I have to fight | 17:37 |
| davest | lpapp: don't fight, just be cool | 17:37 |
| lpapp | for factors, like better readable error messages for end users, easier to get into the circles, etc. | 17:37 |
| lpapp | I would rather not fight ... | 17:38 |
| Jefro | lpapp the website is my jurisdiction. Do you have a specific suggestion? | 17:38 |
| lpapp | but people are reluctant to improving stuff... not sure why, really. | 17:38 |
| hollisb | davest++ | 17:38 |
| lpapp | Jefro: there could be a meetings section | 17:40 |
| lpapp | either main site, or wiki. | 17:40 |
| lpapp | I prefer main because I dislike wikis. | 17:40 |
| Jefro | There is one public meeting. I think perhaps a page rather than an entire section. | 17:41 |
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| Jefro | I can add a page under the Community section (see Tools & Resources) | 17:41 |
| dvhart | Something in tools and resources makes sense to me | 17:41 |
| lpapp | Jefro: in that case, you could add it beside the irc channal name. | 17:41 |
| lpapp | as an additional note. | 17:42 |
| lpapp | perhaps it could even be in the topic. | 17:42 |
| lpapp | in the topic at least when the meeting starts, that is. | 17:42 |
| lpapp | or not topic, but announcement | 17:42 |
| lpapp | not that YPTM: foo joined | 17:42 |
| lpapp | usually meeting bots starts with the topic. | 17:42 |
| lpapp | start* | 17:42 |
| lpapp | and where to look for information, wiki to the agenda, etc. | 17:43 |
| dvhart | lpapp, what do you mean "not that YPTM: foo joined"? | 17:43 |
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| lpapp | Jefro: https://www.yoctoproject.org/tools-resources/community/irc | 17:43 |
| lpapp | you could add the info in ther. | 17:43 |
| lpapp | there* | 17:43 |
| Jefro | yes, although the call is actually a telephone call in addition to IRC. It can be linked in more than one place. | 17:44 |
| sgw_ | lpapp: I did post the callin info at the start of the meeting | 17:44 |
| lpapp | https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4959 | 17:44 |
| yocti | Bug 4959: normal, Undecided, ---, jeffrey.osier-mixon, NEW , Add some information about YPTM | 17:44 |
| lpapp | sgw_: don't you think one needs to get info before calling something? :) | 17:45 |
| Jefro | lpapp thanks for the bug | 17:45 |
| lpapp | at least, I will not make semi-random calls. :) | 17:46 |
| lpapp | Jefro: thanks for taking care. | 17:46 |
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| lpapp | can I tell bitbake on the command line which version to build? | 17:52 |
| lpapp | for instance "... bitbake u-boot ..." | 17:52 |
| sgw_ | lpapp, you can use the -b option with the path to your recipe (not just the recipe name) | 17:56 |
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| lpapp | k, ty. | 17:57 |
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| rburton | lpapp: you asked earlier about schedule and stuff: https://wiki.yoctoproject.org/wiki/Yocto_1.5_Schedule | 18:26 |
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| mr_science | lpapp: note the -b option disables dep resolution and a couple of other things | 18:35 |
| mr_science | use PREFERRED_VERSION_foo = "X.X" | 18:36 |
| mr_science | unless it's just a one-off build of version X.X... | 18:37 |
| sgw_ | mr_science: right, I should have mentioned that, thank you. The PREFERRED_VERSION_foo should be set in a configure file, like a distro config or local.conf. | 18:37 |
| sgw_ | khem: did you see my note about the 2.18 eglibc tarball being missing, we should probably get it up on download.yoctoproject.org | 18:40 |
| * kergoth looks into creating a systemd service for chen qi's r/o script(s) to try using those bits on a systemd image | 18:41 | |
| kergoth | I wish I had known that contrib branch existed before we pursued a different approach, heh | 18:42 |
| mr_science | sgw_: hard to keep track of all the stuff winging at lpapp these days... ;) | 18:47 |
| sgw_ | kergoth: he just started working on it this last week. Hopefully not too much duplicated work. | 18:55 |
| kergoth | not too much, only part of it covers the same area (how the read-only specific volatiles are handled). i still think we need to consolidate volatiles / tmpfiles handling if for no other reason than to reduce differentiation between sysvinit and systemd and to avoid recipe maintenance headaches | 18:56 |
| kergoth | I'd like to see improved systemd support all around in the 1.5 timeframe | 18:56 |
| kergoth | heh | 18:56 |
| * mr_science votes for reduced recipe maintenance too | 19:00 | |
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| sgw_ | kergoth: yes that would be great, I think we between chen's work and your work, we can get a good patch set. I am not sure if he comes up on IRC or not. | 19:04 |
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| kergoth | good god, i forgot what a from scratch build looks like | 19:05 |
| * kergoth populating a new sstate cache on a new build VM | 19:05 | |
| sgw_ | kergoth: why not use SSTATE_MIRROR from an older build? | 19:06 |
| sgw_ | kergoth: unless you want a pristine sstate cache | 19:06 |
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| rburton | kergoth: the first 500 tasks hurt, don't they | 19:06 |
| kergoth | sgw_: old vm went kaput on me, couldn't get back into it anymore, stopped booting | 19:07 |
| kergoth | heh | 19:07 |
| kergoth | rburton: indeed | 19:07 |
| kergoth | even using an external toolchain it's just painful | 19:07 |
| rburton | sstate ftw. | 19:08 |
| kergoth | yeah, as brittle as it can be, at least the rebuilds are only a subset of what there is, and the natives dont' get rebuilt much | 19:09 |
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| kergoth | its that up front build of all the native stuff thats the worst :) | 19:09 |
| * kergoth wishes he could shove all his sstate into nfs to share amongst his vms, but the performance just isn't there, nor is the disk space, end up storing it locally instead | 19:10 | |
| kergoth | would be nice if we had a virtual backing store for the sstate cache, which the build could both pull from and push to, transparently, not just locally | 19:10 |
| rburton | kergoth: isn't that called NFS or CIFS? :) | 19:11 |
| kergoth | well yeah, if they didn't suck horribly | 19:11 |
| kergoth | :) | 19:11 |
| rburton | filesystems are hard etc ;) | 19:12 |
| rburton | anyway there's an oven on downstairs that doesn't have any dinner in, i best resolve that | 19:12 |
| rburton | tata | 19:12 |
| kergoth | indeed, later | 19:12 |
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| mr_science | samba mounts an nfs are about the same on GigE | 19:15 |
| mr_science | *and | 19:15 |
| mr_science | maybe 11 MB/sec max | 19:16 |
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| mr_science | at least on my local corp network... | 19:24 |
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| fenrig | Hi | 20:37 |
| fenrig | bitbake doesn't want to reparse conf/bblayers.conf | 20:37 |
| fenrig | I always get: "NOTE: Your conf/bblayers.conf has been automatically updated. Please re-run bitbake." | 20:37 |
| fenrig | How do i get rid of it (rerunning bitbake doesn't fix anything) | 20:37 |
| fenrig | for instance how does bitbake know if it changed | 20:38 |
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| kergoth | there's a version number in it. compare it to the one in meta/conf/ and meta-yocto/conf/ | 20:40 |
| fenrig | kergoth: okay that fixed it kinda :D | 20:45 |
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| martiert | I have a problem with my kernel defconfig. I have a linux-yocto_3.4.bbappend which specifies a sha sum and adds file://defconfig to SRC_URI | 21:01 |
| martiert | with this, the defconfig is not copied into .config, and I can fix that by adding a cp ${WORKDIR}/defconfig ${S}/.config in a do_configure_prepend, but then do_kernel_configcheck fails | 21:02 |
| martiert | any ideas on what I can do to fix this? | 21:02 |
| bluelightning | zeddii: ^ | 21:05 |
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| fray | 'k | 21:59 |
| fray | oops | 21:59 |
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| bluelightning | martiert: hmm, I guess he's not around; I'd suggest sending the same thing to the mailing list and CC Bruce | 22:05 |
| bluelightning | martiert: sorry I know you've been struggling with this for a couple of days | 22:05 |
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