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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #701 of nightly-mips64 is complete: Failure [failed Running Sanity Tests] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org/main/builders/nightly-mips64/builds/701 | 03:44 | |
| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #1075 of nightly-multilib is complete: Failure [failed BuildImages_4 Running Sanity Tests_4] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org/main/builders/nightly-multilib/builds/1075 | 03:45 | |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #1057 of nightly-mips is complete: Failure [failed Running Sanity Tests] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org/main/builders/nightly-mips/builds/1057 | 04:00 | |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #1058 of nightly-non-gpl3 is complete: Failure [failed BuildImages] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org/main/builders/nightly-non-gpl3/builds/1058 | 04:19 | |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #1080 of nightly-x86 is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org/main/builders/nightly-x86/builds/1080 | 04:59 | |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #1085 of nightly-arm is complete: Failure [failed BuildImages_3 Running ESDK Sanity Tests] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org/main/builders/nightly-arm/builds/1085 | 07:01 | |
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| ahmet__ | hi all, | 07:09 |
|---|---|---|
| ahmet__ | I do not want to include "qtimageformats" when compiling yocto in qt, how can I get rid of it. | 07:09 |
| ahmet__ | ? | 07:09 |
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| *** lukma <lukma!~lukma@87-206-159-178.dynamic.chello.pl> has joined #yocto | 08:18 | |
| lukma | Dear All, | 08:18 |
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| lukma | Can somebody point me the "correct" way of managing the defconfig file for linux-custom recipe | 08:19 |
| lukma | Up till now I do use the "defconfig" file (which is a simple copy of .config) | 08:19 |
| lukma | it all works but is clumsy to maintain | 08:19 |
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| lukma | instead there are also <project-name>. cfg files | 08:20 |
| lukma | which looks like a better place for customization | 08:21 |
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| lukma | Is there a way to tell the kernel to use only the "defconfig" (output from make saveconfig) ? | 08:22 |
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| Ramose | Seeing this error message while building gdb , ERROR: gdb was skipped: incompatible with license GPLv2 & GPLv3 & LGPLv2 & LGPLv3 | 08:23 |
| lukma | or shall I use some standard defconfig (e.g. /arch/arm/configs/omap2plus_defconfig) ? | 08:25 |
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| mckoan | good morning | 08:29 |
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| RP | morning | 08:50 |
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| quite | How feasible would it be to have bitbake/devtool infer BUILDDIR by look for conf/bblayers.conf in cwd or somewhere above cwd? (the way git looks for .git) | 08:52 |
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| ant_work | RP: hi. You helped with klcc.cross. Recipe seems having survived to RSS. Could you pls. check and spot eventual changes to do? https://tinyurl.com/hhl76c7 | 08:55 |
| RP | ant_work: Why does it need eventual changes? | 08:57 |
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| ant_work | I've spotted some sysroot preprocess patches | 08:58 |
| ant_work | flowing in the list | 08:58 |
| RP | ant_work: a quick glance at what you shared looks like it should be ok | 08:58 |
| ant_work | all seems fine, was just wondering. Thanks :) | 08:59 |
| ant_work | btw, the issue was that klcc-cross is built per arch but contained machine-specific paths. | 09:00 |
| ant_work | so we did want it to rebuild for each machine | 09:00 |
| bluelightning | quite: at one point it did do something like that, I'm not sure when it broke | 09:01 |
| bluelightning | it was a while ago I suspect | 09:01 |
| bluelightning | quite: devtool should be runnable while not located in BUILDDIR though - are you seeing otherwise? | 09:02 |
| RP | ant_work: with rss it has to relocate for each recipe that uses it. Making it machine specific would not serve any purpose really | 09:03 |
| RP | ant_work: it will now contain recipe specific paths... | 09:04 |
| ant_work | right..maybe that mangling is not necessary anymore | 09:04 |
| ant_work | it started when we got machine specific sysroot | 09:05 |
| RP | ant_work: you probably will need the mangling to change it between the recipe paths | 09:05 |
| RP | ant_work: but the good news is the old mangling should work for rss just as well | 09:05 |
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| ant_work | it seems it does indeed | 09:06 |
| ant_work | the build problems of 4-5 days ago are gone | 09:06 |
| ant_work | I'll do some tests, thanks again | 09:07 |
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| rburton | something really weird going on with glibc | 09:13 |
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| rburton | RP: http://errors.yoctoproject.org/Errors/Latest/Autobuilder/?filter=5280ab2e897dd1dfd0354cddf34553c568a8bdc9&type=commit | 09:13 |
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| RP | rburton: :(. Widespread or just occasional issues? | 09:15 |
| rburton | occasional | 09:16 |
| rburton | but i've seen occasional things here too | 09:16 |
| RP | rburton: and you suspect my locale change? | 09:16 |
| rburton | like glibc-locale changing its contents dramatically between builds | 09:16 |
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| RP | rburton: taking http://errors.yoctoproject.org/Errors/Details/130265/ specifically, its odd as if you read glibc-package.inc, do_stash_locale is added after do_install and before do_package and contains a line to move the gconv files. How do the files therefore still exist at do_package? | 09:21 |
| rburton | no idea | 09:21 |
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| nrossi | anyone know if it is possible to have bitbake handle modifying a tasks depends based on the fetched source? | 09:34 |
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| bluelightning | nrossi: that would be challenging... we can't adjust task dependencies at the stage where we're actually running tasks, it has to be done beforehand | 09:49 |
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| bluelightning | nrossi: if you can determine what you need to know earlier (e.g. in anonymous python) you might be able to do such a thing, but of course that means fetching during parsing which is ugly | 09:50 |
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| Ramose_ | How can one compile QT with debug symbols in Yocto ? | 10:00 |
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| ed2 | rburton: hi, did you try to merge Kristian's exclude-path patchset? Any problems with it? | 10:35 |
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| RP | nrossi: that is indeed challenging and has some determinism issues | 10:39 |
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| RP | rburton: ah, there is nothing which says do_package has to run after do_stash_locale | 10:49 |
| RP | rburton: you know, this could even explain the mystery pseudo permissions in the locales | 10:49 |
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| RP | rburton: well, there is actually a depends but it also depends on whether it comes from sstate now | 10:51 |
| ionte | hi. wonder if someone could help me with a uboot problem: | 10:58 |
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| ionte | i've always been building my custom yocto distro in debian and there is no problem with booting | 10:58 |
| ionte | but today i've built the distro on a fedora machine and there was no problems building it. but it fails to boot: it does not find /boot/zimage. | 10:59 |
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| ionte | so i entered the uboot console and listed the files on that partition, and it says "unrecognized filesystem type" | 10:59 |
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| ionte | the partition type is "Linux" and filesystem type is ext4. | 11:01 |
| ionte | no problem reading it on my fedora workstation, and the other partition is detected correctly (w95 fat). | 11:02 |
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| ionte | changing to ext2 worked, but i have no idea why it worked with ext4 when built on debian.... | 11:22 |
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| mckoan | how can I get rid of this annoying message: root@beaglebone:~# random: sshd: uninitialized urandom read | 11:28 |
| mckoan | Poky (Yocto Project Reference Distro) 2.1.2 beaglebone /dev/ttyO0 | 11:29 |
| rburton | what bit? | 11:36 |
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| Xabier | Hello everyone | 11:48 |
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| RP | rburton: http://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/commit/?h=rpurdie/wip-rss&id=b964c6e315b60537d8cfc2abacc67c8773ef54de - I think this might help. Not sure if its everything | 12:33 |
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| ant_work | rburton: I have a little patch in queue since 25.1. Is the queue so big? | 12:35 |
| ant_work | Patch ID: 136438 It keeps the same typo as the ancestor ;) | 12:37 |
| rburton | ant_work: i tend to hope zedd will review kernel stuff too, but i've just tagged that for merge | 12:39 |
| ant_work | thanks | 12:39 |
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| ant_work | I was before abusing of KERNEL_OUTPUT but today KERNEL_OUTPUT_DIR does not allow that | 12:41 |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #454 of nightly-checkuri is complete: Failure [failed BuildImages] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org/main/builders/nightly-checkuri/builds/454 | 13:21 | |
| jku | how do I describe a dependency where e.g. openssl:do_cve_check() needs cve-check-tool to be in the recipe-sysroot-native, but I don't want to use DEPENDS (since configure/compile shouldn't need cve-check-tool) | 13:27 |
| jku | or is that not possible? | 13:28 |
| joshuagl | you can add a depends to a task | 13:29 |
| rburton | but you need to get the recipe sysroot populated | 13:29 |
| rburton | and a depends won't do that | 13:29 |
| joshuagl | oh, I guess all of my oe-core fu is outdated with the addition of rss :-( | 13:29 |
| rburton | yeah | 13:29 |
| rburton | same here | 13:29 |
| rburton | RP ^ | 13:29 |
| rburton | also see mariano's insane.bbclass patch from last night | 13:30 |
| rburton | which has the same problem | 13:30 |
| joshuagl | too busy to track oe-core :-( | 13:30 |
| Crofton|work | hmm, today need to prepare insane patch checking for which | 13:30 |
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| RP | jku, rburton, joshuagl: do_cve_check[depends] += " cve-check-tool:do_populate_sysroot" ? | 13:33 |
| joshuagl | RP: exactly what I was trying to suggest | 13:33 |
| rburton | afaik it already does that | 13:34 |
| jku | no, it's different :) | 13:34 |
| rburton | ah | 13:34 |
| rburton | i should pay attention more | 13:34 |
| joshuagl | make me doubt myself rburton, ugh! | 13:34 |
| jku | I thought I tried that though -- let me retry, it's kind of complex | 13:34 |
| jku | huh, it does populate recipe-sysroot-native -- of course I now get a different backtrace but that's something else. Thanks! | 13:39 |
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| rburton | ah | 14:12 |
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| -YoctoAutoBuilder- build #1059 of nightly-non-gpl3 is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org/main/builders/nightly-non-gpl3/builds/1059 | 14:25 | |
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| jku | rburton:now it fails to dlopen modules (because of course it needs to have loadable modules) from the wrong sysroot. Is there a best practice for this situation? | 14:27 |
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| jku | I mean, I could add support for a env variable CVE_CHECK_MODULE_DIR ... but is there a way to have this Just Work? | 14:28 |
| ipuustin | jku: compile a static binary ;-) | 14:29 |
| ipuustin | jku: seriously, I think this is actually a pretty common pattern, which many analysis tools might follow. | 14:29 |
| rburton | jku: there's a bug to let us mark strings in the binary as needing relocation, but it's non-trivial | 14:30 |
| jku | ah right | 14:30 |
| rburton | jku: add support for an env var, then use create_wrapper | 14:30 |
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| jku | yeah I see that in gdk-pixbuf-native... let's see | 14:31 |
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| rburton | the relocation thing is neat, but i need to finish my rewrite of the elf parser | 14:33 |
| rburton | (or just copy-paste pyelf into oe core) | 14:34 |
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| pohly | jku: yesterday I asked about a dangling symlink in the sysroot, something with OpenSSL. RP said you had a bug open for that. Do you have the bug number for me? | 14:37 |
| jku | pohly https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10976 | 14:38 |
| yocti | Bug 10976: normal, High, 2.3 M3, richard.purdie, ACCEPTED , Broken openssl-native symlinks | 14:38 |
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| pohly | jku: yes, that looks like what I ran into. | 14:40 |
| RP | pohly: http://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/commit/?h=rpurdie/wip-rss&id=8c72b30e45dd8bbe13c8c7452c3d47e0c7ae0c5d is a fix | 14:41 |
| kanavin1 | rburton: I wonder how desktop distros do the 'cve check' thing | 14:41 |
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| kanavin1 | maybe they have a human that follows some mailing list, and creates a queue of tasks | 14:42 |
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| rburton | yes | 14:42 |
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| joshuagl | humans + community (http://oss-security.openwall.org/wiki/mailing-lists) + tools | 14:50 |
| kanavin1 | joshuagl: what are the tools? | 14:52 |
| joshuagl | kanavin1: distro specific i.e. https://security-team.debian.org/security_tracker.html#about | 14:54 |
| joshuagl | "Twice a day a cron job runs that pulls down the latest full CVE lists from MITRE, automatically checks that in into data/CVE/list, and also syncs that file with other lists like data/DSA/list and data/DTSA/list." | 14:55 |
| rburton | which is then manually processed to evaluate what impacts debian | 14:55 |
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| kanavin1 | joshuagl: more importantly, "Processing TODO entries means checking if the problem affects Debian and if so which packages, as well as evaluate their severity. This information is based on research and not just in the CVE description in order to prevent integrating false positives or incorrect data in the security tracker." | 14:55 |
| kanavin1 | research, meaning, manual work by a human | 14:56 |
| joshuagl | indeed | 14:56 |
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| joshuagl | I put humans first for a reason | 14:57 |
| kanavin1 | perhaps we should abandon any kind of automatic check attempts, and do it similarly | 14:57 |
| RP | kanavin1: I don't think we'll escape the need for humans but we can make their work much easier | 14:58 |
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| joshuagl | we don't have as many humans as Debian, either | 14:59 |
| joshuagl | so we need tools to help us as much as possible | 14:59 |
| kanavin1 | I wonder who pays the salary of Debian's humans. Canonical? | 15:00 |
| rburton | the security team is likely partially canonical employees and partially volunteers | 15:00 |
| joshuagl | an awful lot of DD's are volunteers, aiui | 15:00 |
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| joshuagl | rburton: any idea of numbers and split? | 15:01 |
| kanavin1 | rburton: checking CVEs sounds like a job no volunteer would want tbh :) | 15:01 |
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| sveinse | I'm looking at the TipsAndTricks list on the Wiki. Is there a tool in yocto to view specific logs? E.g. to view do_compile from recipe xyz? I find I do a lot of "directory-dancing" to look at specific log and run files? | 15:02 |
| rburton | joshuagl: a random security team minutes mail has 8 attendees | 15:02 |
| rburton | sveinse: i use 'bb' but i think its still broken thanks to tinfoil2 | 15:02 |
| rburton | sveinse: 'bb log xyz compile' | 15:02 |
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| sveinse | rburton: thanks. Otherwise that would be a great contribution to yocto IMHO | 15:04 |
| rburton | bb is awesome | 15:05 |
| rburton | kergoth needs to fix it :) | 15:05 |
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| kergoth | rburton: My current thought, though not yet set in stone, is to prototype a new command that's an actual bitbake UI, and implement the commands as proper internal bitbake commands, and ideally move it into the bitbake repo. | 15:20 |
| kergoth | been meaning for its bits to go upstream for years, this is a good excuse to do something about it.. | 15:20 |
| joshuagl | \o/ | 15:20 |
| kergoth | need to start a discussion thread on the architecture list | 15:21 |
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| sveinse | pity, bb is too new for my krogoth release it seems :( ..or, I've got a poky/bitbake/lib/bb directory. I wonder how I can access it from shell | 15:26 |
| kergoth | sveinse: krogoth branch in the bb repo.... | 15:27 |
| kergoth | not particularly hard to find | 15:27 |
| kergoth | lib/bb is the bb python package used by bitbake, completely different than the tool | 15:27 |
| sveinse | ah, sorry, yes | 15:27 |
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| sveinse | Sorry for asking stupid questions, but how is the bb repo related to the poky repo? Because it contains bb doesn't it? | 15:30 |
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| kanavin1 | sveinse: poky repo is made from several repositories put together, including bb and oe-core repos | 15:34 |
| kanavin1 | sveinse: think of poky as a gigantic example of how to make a distribution using bitbake and oe-core | 15:35 |
| rburton | sveinse: kergoth's bb is entirely unrelated (kergoth/bb on github) | 15:38 |
| kergoth | indeed, completely serperate utility, outside of bitbake | 15:38 |
| sveinse | Right. | 15:39 |
| sveinse | BTW are there any yocto-based distros that don't rely on poky? My impression is that the SoC vendors all tag on to Poky in some form or another (and thus as a user of these SoC package, so are we) | 15:40 |
| rburton | i'd say that impression is wrong | 15:41 |
| rburton | poky is literally oe-core + bitbake + very little anyway | 15:42 |
| sveinse | quite possible | 15:42 |
| kanavin1 | rburton: I remember someone on the list saying they're not using poky (was it Philip?) | 15:43 |
| pohly | Ostro OS was not using Poky. | 15:44 |
| sveinse | in our product's imx6 sources we have poky, meta-openembedded, meta-fsl-arm and som machine specific layers | 15:44 |
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| kanavin1 | rburton: what is the purpose of meta-yocto-bsp? | 15:47 |
| sveinse | But as na "application product developer"-ish, the lines between yocto, poky and bitbake and the machine layers appears quite blurry. A steep learning curve. I've been doing this for a year on and off, and I still feel I have no firm overview :D | 15:47 |
| kanavin1 | rburton: I mean, why is it separate from meta-poky? | 15:48 |
| kergoth | distro and bsp/machine should always be maintained separately | 15:49 |
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| kergoth | sveinse: yocto is just an umbrella project used for companies to collaborate on bitbake, oe-core, and other components used as the core of their products. poky is an example distro, and also a repository that encompasses the other projects for convenient testing. most distros should *copy* contents from poky if appropriate rather than basing upon it, though some do. | 15:51 |
| sveinse | But, the bsp/machine binds the distro somehow. At least for the HW architectures we use. E.g. we've wanted krogoth for a long time, but the HW vendor did not support it yet, so we were stuck on jethro. | 15:51 |
| kergoth | wrong | 15:51 |
| kergoth | distro, machine, and image are key orthogonal axes of the build. if your distro doesnt' work witha ny arbitrary machine, then your distro is broken | 15:52 |
| rburton | sveinse: that's version, not distro | 15:52 |
| kergoth | any machine should work with any distro which should work with any image, generally | 15:52 |
| kergoth | see also https://db.tt/F3bHEZRe, which i wrote a long time ago, and could probably use some updating, but covers this | 15:52 |
| * kergoth also isn't much of a writer | 15:53 | |
| sveinse | generally, but it doesn't turn out that pretty all the time. I mean, we are depending on the Yocto version released by the HW vendor, because we don't have the resources to take on the detailed Yocto work | 15:53 |
| seebs | i would say that's pretty well-written, kergoth. | 15:54 |
| kergoth | I don't see what using vendor content instead of upstream has to do with machine vs distro | 15:54 |
| sveinse | I visited Electronica this year and asked around HW vendors for Yocto support and for Krogoth. And many answered that they does not support every Yocto release, as Freescale (now NXP) does not release for every Yocto release | 15:54 |
| kergoth | they're two different things, and good vendors maintain that separation | 15:54 |
| kergoth | yocto version is a different question, as rburton indicates | 15:55 |
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| rburton | sveinse: vendors may not want to track the six monthly releases, that's fine. | 15:55 |
| rburton | sucks to be a customer if you want a release they don't support, but there's only two choices then | 15:56 |
| rburton | 1) use their product anyway 2) don't use their product citing that as a reason | 15:56 |
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| sveinse | rburton: I'm not a end-user thou. We're making a custom embedded product, in which we use Yocto to build the software. But we're dependent on bsp layers from other vendors | 15:57 |
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| fray | every 6 months for most semi's and board vendors and even customers is too often.. which is why we've got 1 year release cadence.. | 15:58 |
| fray | but what they are telling you is correct. If the vendor is too old, tell them and go elsewhere.. it is the ONLY way to get themt o change.. | 15:58 |
| fray | (WR's release is always on the fall version) | 15:59 |
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| fray | morty, jethro, dizzy, dora, danny... | 15:59 |
| sveinse | I'm not complaing per se, I'm just elaborating on the binding between Yocto versions and BSP availability. But as kergoth points out, I'm mixing poky and release versions. | 16:00 |
| rburton | sure, there's binding between releases and what the BSP vendors support. | 16:01 |
| fray | but kergoth is 100% correct.. for a particular version.. BSP, distro and image recipes are all orthogonal.. I do often see though BSPs making distribution changes... or adding packages to an image type.. | 16:02 |
| kergoth | Only slightly related, but as an OSV, manually determining the delta between the public layers from the hardware vendors and the layers they shipped in their own release BSPs is rather painful | 16:02 |
| fray | these are all things that should be discouraged.. | 16:02 |
| rburton | BSPs making distro changes is explicitly forbidden by the compliance guidelines | 16:02 |
| fray | kergoth -- in general, we ignore the semi vendor BSP layers as 'less then useful'. | 16:02 |
| sveinse | But admitedly, and being the Yocto responsible in our company, its hard to distinguish even for me working some time on this. Lots of details. | 16:02 |
| fray | rburton only recently were those guidelines updated.. and a lot of BSPs I've seen still do it | 16:03 |
| khem | rburton: Can you sent more details on glibc issue you are seeing ? | 16:04 |
| khem | rburton: an example that I could reproduce | 16:05 |
| rburton | khem: wish i could reproduce :/ | 16:05 |
| sveinse | Our HW vendor (which is a custom design), heavily modifies poky and meta-openembedded. And yes, this should not happen in an ideal world, many often take the easy way out and do it still. We as the customer, generally don't care about the intricate detals of how things are solved in yocto. Until it does not work... And it's not easy to police | 16:05 |
| rburton | khem: http://errors.yoctoproject.org/Errors/Latest/Autobuilder/?filter=5280ab2e897dd1dfd0354cddf34553c568a8bdc9&type=commit has more failures | 16:05 |
| fray | the YP compliance guidelines (if followed) can be used as a hammer in those cases.. | 16:05 |
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| fray | requiring the vendor to adhere to them, and then making them fix it when they don't is a reasonable approach -- and one I often recommend even to our own customers.. | 16:06 |
| kergoth | indeed | 16:06 |
| kergoth | that reminds me, i just noticed a recipe file in our distro layer, need to move that.. | 16:06 |
| fray | we have recipes in our distro -- but they are distribution specific and can be proven to only modify the behavior of the recipes if the distro is enabled.. | 16:07 |
| fray | (unfortunately they do change checksums just by being there, but don't change behavior) | 16:07 |
| fray | [we very much limit that behavior, but sometimes it's needed] | 16:07 |
| khem | fray OSVs and OEMs are different set of needs | 16:07 |
| khem | OSVs are benefitted immensely by following the structure since they support many different machines | 16:07 |
| fray | if the guidelines are flawed, lets get them fixed.. there should be no difference in behavior between OSV and OEM (when the OEM is playign OSV) | 16:08 |
| khem | OEMs however supports only a few. there is no clear advantage for them | 16:08 |
| khem | or perceived | 16:08 |
| kergoth | it's worth noting that the yocto compliance guidelines aren't just to make sure people are following conventions, they make it easier for *them* to maintain | 16:08 |
| fray | just to be clear, I'm not saying an OEM needs to do everything an OSV does.. but they do need to follow the guidelines or they're going to causing trouble for their own custoemrs | 16:08 |
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| khem | if they are not being followed then either this is not communicated properly or people did not find the advantage as promised | 16:09 |
| fray | (I regularly talk to different OEMs about this, and often times they don't even know what their developers are doing since their external contractors.. which makes it difficult for them to even police them.. mention the compliance guidelines and it helps them reign in their own developers | 16:09 |
| fray | in the cases I know of, "they don't care" or worse.. they see it as a strategic 'lockin' to NOT follow the rules | 16:09 |
| fray | "if I make the changes here, it will be harder for my customer to move to a different hardware platform" | 16:10 |
| fray | (and yes, I have had an OEM tell me exactly that in the last year) | 16:10 |
| sveinse | I think the difficulties are that we want to get away with as little efforts in Yocto as possible. Our objective is to make our products and care very little in how the lower ends (e.g. Yocto) are implemented. I mean, my resources spendage on Yocto is challenged, because that is not our core competency. | 16:10 |
| khem | that does happen, however OEMs are getting more aware and want to own the platform | 16:10 |
| fray | problem is they want to own the platform and put in minimal effort to do that.. competition in this case is good... locking in customers annoys everyone | 16:11 |
| khem | sveinse: thats right. however you still need to figure out the best use | 16:11 |
| khem | to meet your needs. | 16:11 |
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| sveinse | If this is the general attitude, then vendors do get away with non YP compliant editions as long as the end product works | 16:12 |
| khem | smartly, otherwise it will come in the way, I guess guidelines help with keeping that barrier | 16:12 |
| sveinse | It not until now, very late in the project, we realize that we should have had quality statements about Yocto | 16:12 |
| khem | although they may not be perfect and meet all needs | 16:12 |
| fray | sveinse the whole point of the Yocto Project, compliance guidelines and ecosystem is so you do NOT have to be an expert, but can be a developer user | 16:12 |
| sveinse | Because we don't have the necessary competency | 16:12 |
| khem | sveinse: if you can enforce compliance as prerequisite e.g. then you can get some work done | 16:13 |
| fray | I think this is something the YP (org) should be promoting.. the compliance is easy to get, and why it's so damned important for everyone to follow the rules | 16:13 |
| khem | in the quality segment. but then for own layers you have to do it yourself | 16:13 |
| khem | fray: again its about communicaton | 16:14 |
| khem | you can never shove things down anyone's throat | 16:14 |
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| khem | there are compelling alternatives | 16:14 |
| khem | you have to have a story they can relate their pains to | 16:14 |
| sveinse | khem: well you can. sort of. In contract engineering it can be set as a requirement | 16:14 |
| fray | no.. but if you tell ODMs to require their OEMs to be Yocto Project compliant.. and the ODMs to tell their OSVs to require it as well.. in the contract | 16:15 |
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| fray | now the ODM has leverage to make sure everyone follows the basic rules.. (distro/bsp/image being ortogonal) | 16:15 |
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| fray | without people requiring this in a contract the compliance is a nice to have and useful -- but people get burned.. thats the bit that YP (org) should be promoting | 16:15 |
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| sveinse | Actually, when I read about distros in Yocto, I start to think that our product should be a distro of its own | 16:18 |
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| rburton | sveinse: yes, it should | 16:19 |
| sveinse | however that is step 7. I still have to fix this pesky taskhash issue thing first... | 16:20 |
| khem | rburton: I would need to be able to reproduce the glibc issue with locale | 16:20 |
| khem | rburton: if you can tell me look at x ipk, it has this content before and is empty after | 16:20 |
| khem | then I would be able to help. We need to move to release from snapshot | 16:21 |
| khem | fray: the traditional OSV/ODM/OEM model is also flattened with yocto. many put together their own distros, so there is no one chain | 16:23 |
| fray | but if the pieces all follow the rules, the problems of conflicts are significantly reduced.. | 16:24 |
| fray | (again we're all talking aobut a simple set of rules, not a complex set)... so there really should not be a burden from the individual developers who produce 'YP compliant components' | 16:24 |
| khem | sveinse: yes, unless you want to hook into pregenerated feeds e.g. say angstrom, you essentially are your own distro | 16:24 |
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| kanavin1 | RP: should rpm4 use nss or beecrypt? | 16:39 |
| kanavin1 | RP: the question came up because nss-native breaks test_sstate_32_64_same_hash, badly | 16:40 |
| rburton | huh | 16:41 |
| rburton | well thats a bug | 16:41 |
| kanavin1 | rburton: there's some host-specific magic in nss recipe which I didn't look at in detail yet | 16:41 |
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| kanavin1 | rburton: the nss recipe is doing this in do_compile: | 16:52 |
| kanavin1 | make -C ./nss CCC="${CXX} -g" \ | 16:52 |
| kanavin1 | OS_TEST=${OS_TEST} \ | 16:52 |
| kanavin1 | RPATH="${RPATH}" | 16:52 |
| kanavin1 | where OS_TEST is set from TARGET_ARCH | 16:52 |
| kanavin1 | any hints how to debug this properly? | 17:00 |
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| rburton | kanavin1: i must be missing something - how does the test work for any native where the target_arch will be different | 17:06 |
| rburton | i'd expect natives to be different if the host is different | 17:06 |
| kanavin1 | rburton: I would expect this as well, but the test was written by RP himself :) | 17:07 |
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| kanavin1 | rburton: and the comment clearly says: " The sstate checksums for both native and target should not vary whether | 17:07 |
| kanavin1 | they're built on a 32 or 64 bit system." | 17:07 |
| rburton | yeah | 17:07 |
| rburton | and it passes | 17:07 |
| * rburton is doing confused face | 17:08 | |
| * kanavin1 is ready for tea+bun | 17:08 | |
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| khem | native checksum will depend on bitness of build host isnt it | 17:12 |
| khem | nativesdk and target may be not | 17:13 |
| rburton | exactly, which is why its odd this test appears to work :) | 17:13 |
| kanavin1 | RP, where art thou | 17:13 |
| kanavin1 | the confusion is spreading | 17:13 |
| khem | rburton: I see that http://errors.yoctoproject.org/Errors/Details/130265/ report unpackaged locale files | 17:15 |
| RP | kanavin1: sorry, here now. What was the question? | 17:15 |
| khem | rburton: I wonder how thats happening | 17:15 |
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| kanavin1 | RP: please read beginning from "should rpm4 use nss or beecrypt?" | 17:15 |
| kanavin1 | RP: I have to run now unfortunately, will be available in an hour or so | 17:16 |
| rburton | RP: short version: how does the sstate_32_64 test work when surely native recipes will change if the build host arch changes | 17:16 |
| RP | kanavin1: so the first answer is nss, not beecrypt | 17:17 |
| kanavin1 | RP: additionally, how does one debug a recipe that fails to be same (nss-native)? | 17:17 |
| RP | rburton, kanavin1: native sstate checksums are actually BUILD_ARCH independent | 17:17 |
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| RP | We account for BUILD_ARCH in the actual locations and filenames, not the checksums | 17:18 |
| rburton | hm | 17:18 |
| RP | This means we have one native checksum which represents all BUILD_ARCHs and therefore target arch checksums don't change depending on BUILD_ARCH | 17:18 |
| rburton | but nss uses BUILD_ARCH directly in the do_compile to pass arguments to make | 17:18 |
| rburton | right | 17:18 |
| RP | so we just need to whitelist this from the checksum basically | 17:19 |
| RP | since the filename will in fact catch it | 17:19 |
| RP | we don't do this globally since we really do want to be careful about this | 17:19 |
| RP | kanavin1: debugging the difference is via bitbake-diffsigs | 17:20 |
| RP | kanavin1: which is basically what that test actually does in many ways | 17:20 |
| rburton | right fun times | 17:20 |
| RP | kanavin1: If I were debugging it I'd use the test but stop it wiping the tmp stamps directories and then run bitbake-diffsigs on nss-native's two differing stamp files | 17:21 |
| rburton | well do_compile just directly uses TARGET_ARCH so in native builds that's BUILD_ARCH, so i guess it just needs a whitelist | 17:21 |
| RP | rburton: BUILD_ARCH is in the base whitelist | 17:22 |
| RP | are you sure its TARGET_ARCH ? | 17:24 |
| rburton | if [ "${TARGET_ARCH}" = "powerpc" ]; then | 17:24 |
| rburton | also | 17:24 |
| rburton | if [ "${SITEINFO_BITS}" = "64" ]; then | 17:24 |
| RP | are you sure its TARGET_ARCH breaking the test? | 17:24 |
| RP | I suspect SITEINFO | 17:24 |
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| RP | kanavin1: so, I hacked the test: http://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/commit/?h=rpurdie/wip-rss&id=5cf656702f5f7fb6e7b50eee1b59758c6727bdc2, then oe-selftest -r sstatetests.SStateTests.test_sstate_32_64_same_hash, which fails as expected, then $ bitbake-diffsigs tmp-sstatesamehash*/stamps/*/nss-native/3.27.1-r0.do_compile.sigdata.* | 17:49 |
| RP | basehash changed from 944cc4554a823ba966aeda0ac3d33b79 to 2475db3659c248d81d0e4dadb3c1b4cd | 17:49 |
| RP | Variable SITEINFO_BITS value changed from '32' to '64' | 17:49 |
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| RP | kanavin1: to figure out the dependency chain you can the run bitbake-diffsigs on a single hash to see that its do_compile which has the dependency and do_compile[vardepsexclude] += "SITEINFO_BITS" should fix it | 17:55 |
| RP | rburton: ^^^ | 17:55 |
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| RP | it then breaks in do_install :) | 17:58 |
| RP | (which needs the same fix) | 17:59 |
| RP | after adding the do_install change, the test passes | 18:00 |
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| jkridner | call for participation in #beagle-gsoc: http://bbb.io/gsoc | 18:05 |
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| sveinse | kergoth: I think your document is great. It describes an overview from the system builder's POV. Gave me a few ideas. Thanks | 19:05 |
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| sveinse | What does it imply to be YP compatible? And I'm not refering to the branding aspects, but rather the technical implications | 19:24 |
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| sveinse | A test suite? Best pratices? Peer review? | 19:25 |
| kanavin_home | RP: thanks, will you make a patch? | 19:25 |
| kanavin_home | RP: what does do_compile[vardepsexclude] do? | 19:26 |
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| sveinse | kanavin_home: I believe it excludes the listed variabled from being included in the sstate cache signature calculations, such as DATETIME. | 19:27 |
| kanavin_home | sveinse: not exactly obvious :-/ | 19:28 |
| sveinse | I'm trying to fix a problem where this probably will be the remedy | 19:28 |
| sveinse | kanavin_home: my explanation or the naming of the variable? | 19:31 |
| kanavin_home | sveinse: the naming of the variable :) | 19:32 |
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| kergoth | sveinse: https://www.yoctoproject.org/ecosystem/yocto-project-branding-program, https://www.yoctoproject.org/ecosystem/participant-registration, https://www.yoctoproject.org/ecosystem/compatible-registration | 19:41 |
| kergoth | the compatible registration has a list of acceptance criteria | 19:41 |
| kergoth | i.e. "Are all your publicly accessible layers listed in the OpenEmbedded Layers index (http://layers.openembedded.org)?", "Do all layers contain a README file which details the origin of the layer, its maintainer, where to submit changes, and any dependencies or version requirements?", etc | 19:42 |
| kergoth | kanavin_home: vardeps is a list of dependent variables, vardepsexclude is a list of vars to exclude from the list of dependent variables | 19:43 |
| kergoth | seems pretty clear to me | 19:43 |
| * kergoth shrugs | 19:43 | |
| kergoth | metadata checksumming uses variable dependency tracking to do the checksum, and the checksum is used in sstate | 19:44 |
| sveinse | kergoth: Is that registration questionare it? | 19:44 |
| kergoth | admittedly it's a pretty low level variable name, but what it does *is* low level, it just affects other layers | 19:44 |
| kergoth | (where layer here refers to concept, not yocto layers :) | 19:44 |
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| kanavin_home | kergoth: is the variable dependency tracking used somewhere else than in checksumming? | 19:52 |
| kergoth | No, but checksumming is used for more than just sstate. | 19:52 |
| kanavin_home | kergoth: then it could mention 'checksum' in the name | 19:53 |
| kanavin_home | kergoth: as it is, it looks as though compile step itself is affected | 19:53 |
| kergoth | i don't see how it's posible to misunderstand 'vardepsexclude' to mean anything other than exclusions from variable dependencies | 19:53 |
| kergoth | it's literally the name | 19:53 |
| kanavin_home | kergoth: it's not obvious what 'variable dependencies' are | 19:54 |
| kergoth | what else would a variable depend on but another variable? | 19:54 |
| kanavin_home | could be made more clear that it's really for checksumming | 19:54 |
| kergoth | making a flag name into a sentence really doesn't seem like a great idea for usability, to me | 19:55 |
| kergoth | but by all means submit a bug | 19:55 |
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| kergoth | it's worth noting that info could well be used for more than just checksumming, it just doesn't happen to do so right now | 19:55 |
| bluelightning | the other usage is when writing out shell scripts - we need to write out all that will be called | 19:56 |
| kergoth | i.e. to enhance how variable expansion works, or limit what varaibles are allowed to be accessed from it | 19:56 |
| kergoth | good point, forgot about that | 19:56 |
| bluelightning | AFAIK | 19:56 |
| kergoth | determines what shell fucntions get emitted | 19:56 |
| kergoth | and vars | 19:56 |
| kergoth | though the vars are generally covered by exports | 19:56 |
| kergoth | flags should indicate precisely what they describe, not necessarily how they're used. it's declarative (ideally) metadata, it's up to bitbake what to do with that.. | 19:57 |
| sveinse | I tend to support kanavin_home on this. It is not plainly obvious what it does. You need to be pretty deep into the inner workings of Yocto to understand what it does. For my part this translates to: This is what you have to write to fix tasksel issues... | 20:01 |
| sveinse | *taskhash mismatch issues | 20:02 |
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| bluelightning | dealing with taskhash mismatch issues is definitely painful | 20:02 |
| bluelightning | I don't think terminology is the main issue though | 20:02 |
| sveinse | yeah, I'm not out of the woods yet | 20:02 |
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| kergoth | I'd really like to prototype plugging into bitbake wrappers around the data store which limit access only to the variables bitbake's dependency tracking knows about. then an attempt to access anything else would immediately fail. would at least ensure we don't miss anything. doesn't help with cases where too much is included, but .. | 20:03 |
| kergoth | s/bitbake/bitbake,/ | 20:03 |
| kanavin_home | kergoth: the problem is that this stuff ends up in recipes, and someone, somewhere might need to understand what it's there for, often years away from the moment this was placed into the recipe | 20:04 |
| kergoth | that's exactly why it shouldn't refer to specific detaisl of how bitbake uses the info. it's an argument for keeping it as is, IMO. it's info about what variables depend on what. how bitbake uses that 10 years from now might or might not be the same as today | 20:05 |
| bluelightning | kanavin_home: arguably, that's what detailed commit messages (and code comments) are for | 20:06 |
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| kanavin_home | bluelightning: more often than not, those do not happen (especially further in the history of oe) | 20:07 |
| kergoth | I'd also like to try revamping the checksumming to use expanded values, not unexpanded values. would allow vardep exclusions to propogate through the dependency graph, and better yet, it'd make sure only the results matter, not how we got there | 20:07 |
| kanavin_home | usually, I just throw away the entire recipe when there's too much undocumented cruft in it, and write a new, simple one, dealing with issues as they occur | 20:08 |
| bluelightning | kergoth: that does sound useful | 20:08 |
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| kergoth | bluelightning: the fact that FOO = "${A}{B}" with A="1" and B="2" results in a different checksum than FOO = "12", when only FOO is referenced, bugs the crap out of me | 20:08 |
| sveinse | I try to comment extensively in the recipe to why a statement is needed. Because in our company, Yocto knowlegde is slim, and the objective for devs to touch recipes is *only* to add support of some piece of software. | 20:09 |
| kanavin_home | sveinse: when I did gobject introspection, I commented pretty much every line and block, because it's a very delicate thing that depends on a lot of things being exactly right | 20:10 |
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| kanavin_home | here's an example of how to NOT write a recipe: http://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky/tree/meta/recipes-connectivity/openssl/openssl.inc | 20:14 |
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| bluelightning | kanavin_home: agreed, that recipe is a mess :( | 20:15 |
| kanavin_home | bluelightning: that's why for openssl 1.1 I'm throwing away all of that and starting from scratch | 20:16 |
| kanavin_home | the only sane way | 20:16 |
| sveinse | My favourite is this: https://github.com/openembedded/meta-openembedded/blob/master/meta-oe/recipes-support/uim/uim_1.8.6.bb -- it's wrond, and we need it in our application | 20:16 |
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| sveinse | I started on fixing it, but it turned out the rabbit hole was simply too deep | 20:17 |
| kergoth | kanavin_home: ditch the make -e while you're at it, if you would, please :) | 20:18 |
| kanavin_home | sveinse: don't fix, write your own :) | 20:18 |
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| kergoth | i wonder why the os/arch mapping was done in shell rather than via a bitbake function, that's odd | 20:18 |
| kergoth | sad part is it was probably me that wrote that.. | 20:19 |
| rburton | kergoth: ah the wisdom of age | 20:19 |
| sveinse | kanavin_home: I made a small emergency patch, so that it works the way it needs to, but the rest is still not pretty | 20:19 |
| rburton | kergoth: that's the big downside of working on a project for a decade isn't it | 20:19 |
| kergoth | indeed | 20:19 |
| kergoth | every time i look at the bitbake codebase it reminds me of how shitty i was at python when we started. thankfully it's evolved a long way since then, but there are still remnants :) | 20:20 |
| kanavin_home | kergoth: make -e? | 20:20 |
| kergoth | kanavin_home: see EXTRA_OEMAKE. -e makes env vars override the makefile. it's relying on the fact that vars like CFLAGS are exported into the shell environment rather than passing them in explicitly | 20:20 |
| kergoth | bad | 20:21 |
| kanavin_home | kergoth: like I said, openssl 1.1 will not be based on this mess at all | 20:21 |
| kanavin_home | a clean rewrite from nothing | 20:21 |
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| kergoth | i know, just a reminder to explicitly pass the variables instead, rather than taking the easy route :) | 20:21 |
| kergoth | was such a mistake doing that.. at the time i just wanted to make most recipes Just Work(™) without needing to explicitly pass things, but that just made it easy for people to stay ignorant of what the underlying makefiles were doing | 20:22 |
| kergoth | :\ | 20:22 |
| sveinse | kergoth: we all have that, don't we. I found some pieces of code in a build system which I wrote 6 years ago, and I go: What? What stupid &%#.. git blame... Oh, right. | 20:22 |
| kergoth | hehe | 20:22 |
| pthomas | where can I find the build directory for a given package? | 20:23 |
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| pthomas | I'm trying to see what the configure options for strongswan are | 20:23 |
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| rburton | pthomas: tmp/work/[machine tune]/strongswan/[version] | 20:24 |
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| pthomas | yeah I see that, but I don't see any source files or source structure | 20:26 |
| pthomas | does this get cleaned up? | 20:26 |
| kergoth | pthomas: sources are only extracted if they're needed. that's how all tasks are done. | 20:26 |
| kanavin_home | pthomas: if the build outputs are available from sstate cache, then there will be no unpacked source there | 20:26 |
| kergoth | bitbake -c patch or -c configure or whatever if you want to get things populated | 20:27 |
| kanavin_home | do a bitbake -c clean_sstate strongswan, followed by bitbake strongswan, then you'll have the source, the binaries, the packages, and logs for every step | 20:28 |
| pthomas | I want to see if it's configured with --enable-eap-tls, it's not in the .bb file, but I wasn't sure if it might be default | 20:30 |
| sveinse | what is the difference between clean_sstate and cleanall? | 20:32 |
| bluelightning | sveinse: cleanall additionally removes downloaded source | 20:32 |
| bluelightning | devtool modify recipename followed by devtool configure-help recipename is one way to get the configure options | 20:33 |
| bluelightning | (both the help and what options are currently specified) | 20:33 |
| lsandov | bluelightning: ping | 20:34 |
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| kergoth | kanavin_home: fyi, cleansstate doesn't guarantee a non-sstate build if sstate mirrors are enabled. it'll just delete the fetched file and re-download it :) | 20:38 |
| kergoth | annoying behavior | 20:39 |
| kergoth | can always -C fetch to force the matter instead, though then you'd want to clean first | 20:39 |
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| sveinse | when I use bitbake-diffsigs and get some/other/recipe.bb.do_image_complete with hash xxx changed to yyy, this implies I need to follow the change backward to find the originating difference, right? | 20:54 |
| kergoth | most likely, yes | 20:55 |
| kergoth | easier to use -S printdiff if it's workable for your case | 20:55 |
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| sveinse | kergoth: os -S printdiff supposed to print anything? | 21:27 |
| sveinse | (wiping tmp and starting over...) | 21:28 |
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| sveinse | Now I can't seem to get the taskhash failed failure at all... | 21:43 |
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| sveinse | I noticed something when using bitbake-diffsigs, that the paths for the recipes have changed. It uses a path which is not local to this build, but belongs to another build. I've verified that the configuration has no cross links. Leakage somehow via the sstate? | 22:04 |
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| bluelightning | sveinse: is bitbake-diffsigs actually reporting that as a difference, or is it just incidental in the output? | 22:07 |
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| sveinse | bluelightning: Its like /path/to/recipe.bb.do_image with hash xxxx changed to /antother/path/recipe.bb.do_image with hash yyyy | 22:09 |
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| sveinse | I ran two consecutive runs of bitbake. Both successful. And still bitbake-diffsigs reports this | 22:10 |
| bluelightning | sveinse: the function's hash should not depend on the recipe path - is that really all it's saying or is there more to the message? | 22:11 |
| sveinse | bluelightning: its quite extensive: https://bpaste.net/show/1339a3048ced | 22:14 |
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| bluelightning | hmm, there's some magling of the paths there I see | 22:16 |
| bluelightning | *mangling | 22:16 |
| bluelightning | what about the diff for do_rootfs? | 22:17 |
| sveinse | Yeah, and the path on line 2 does not belong to this build, line 4 is | 22:17 |
| bluelightning | sure... I'd ignore that part for now, it seems to be indicating that it's the do_rootfs task as actually having changed | 22:18 |
| sveinse | bluelightning: The thing is that I am chaining images, initrd into image, image into installer image, so it very probably some DATETIME thing which leaks. Its just very hard to find. Here is a small snippet of the setup: https://bpaste.net/show/d4300772b150 | 22:23 |
| sveinse | In this paste, it is always and only c-image.do_rootfs_wicenv that fails iirc | 22:25 |
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| Marex | Hi! I ran into an issue with poky 2.2.1 when building for aarch64 with multilib | 22:30 |
| Marex | using the 32bit toolchain, if I prepare a C file which includes <signal.h> , the kernel's sigcontext.h is pulled in , but that contains __uint128_t type which the 32bit compiler doesn't support | 22:31 |
| bluelightning | sveinse: hmm, can't see anything immediately wrong with that... | 22:31 |
| Marex | anyone saw that before ? | 22:31 |
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| sveinse | bluelightning: just parsed and diffed the long list of packages that diffsigs claims changed, and they are equal! | 22:43 |
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| sveinse | I wish I could inspect the temp/ (the logs) directory of the objects fetched from the sstate cache | 22:50 |
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