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| marex | paulbarker: done, I put you on CC of the fitImage fix backporting thread. The fitImage bugs were fixed in master 7 weeks ago, it would be nice to finally land the fix backports in OE wrynose, else wrynose fitImage support isn't usable | 00:05 |
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| Guest33 | Hello everyone, | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | does anyone in this channel have experience with multi-hardware, multi-image setups of yocto? | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | I am currently trying to improve our current yocto setup where everything was originally thrown into one layer. I already achieved to split this up into a *-bsp layer with all our hardware configurations (a.k.a. machines) and "the rest" which I think is most likely our *-distro layer. | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | This now leaves me with a situation where I have to figure out how to best include software packages for individual image builds from the software bouquet of our distro layer. | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | Specifically a way that allows me to include specific versions of software packages into those images in a way that can easily be tracked over time/releases/builds. | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | Currently whenever there is an update for a software package within our *-distro layer its recipe is simply updated (renamed) to the new version. Unfortunately that means that from that point onward all images using that software package will have to use the new version whether they want to or not. This has already created some problems, e.g. a | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | newer version of a software package installed into one image crashed older software packages being installed in another image. | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | It would therefore be nice if there was a way to control which recipe/software package versions go into which images. | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | Is there some mechanism in yocto that allows to do this? | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | Something like a list of software packges per image recipe maybe? | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | Or is this somehow handled differently in yocto? | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | Or maybe I am looking at this the wrong way and this is already inherently solved by yocto+git somehow? | 07:10 |
| Guest33 | Would appreciate any insights anyone is willing to share. | 07:10 |
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| Guest33 | Oh, sorry for the wall of text. That looked smaller within vscode. | 07:12 |
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| LetoThe2nd | Guest33: if your packages are properly versioned, the PREFERRED_VERSION can be declared per build | 07:17 |
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| Guest33 | LetoThe2nd: we use semantic versioning. Should that be sufficient? Can the PREFERRED_VERSION be used in image recipes as well? Asking because to my current knowledge I only ever saw this being used in machine configurations to determine the "virtual/kernel" or "u-boot" version being used for a particular machine. | 07:27 |
| LetoThe2nd | Guest33: semantic versioning helps, but is by itself neither a requirement nor necessary. PREFERRED_VERSION cannot be used per image, only per build (means, DISTRO; MACHINE; local.conf, etc..) | 07:28 |
| mcfrisk | Guest33: it is an anti-pattern to have multiple versions of the same SW component recipes. They can be managed but they must not have conflicts in sysroot files etc. An image recipe can fully control what gets installed to it. Managing the full dependency tree with compatible and incompatible providers, and the runtime ABI compatibility is even harder. All SW stack (image) variants need to be tested and | 07:34 |
| mcfrisk | verified on target. Thus I think it is easier to keep compatibility interfaces within the SW component itself, e.f. soname, ABI, and then willingly break that and migrate all users. | 07:34 |
| mcfrisk | different meta layer branches, different build configurations (machine, distro, local.conf) can all achieve the same build time output. But developers have an easier life when there is just a single set of meta layers, single machine/distro/build config variant, and multiple output images for different uses. This requires that SW components must support all variants from a single binary build. And that | 07:37 |
| mcfrisk | that variants are configured in image recipes and detected at runtime in HW. | 07:37 |
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| Guest33 | LetoThe2nd: ok, so we wouldn't need to change the versioning schema, that's good. For the PREFERRED_VERSION that would then probably be something we would use within our local.conf since we want the distro layer to be as generic as possible as well as the bsp layer. In case this list would grow bigger than, let's say, 5-10 software packages. Do you | 07:39 |
| Guest33 | know if there is a way to include another file in local.conf? I am thinking about having the software packages list separate next to the local.conf file. That might managing different software packages setups easier. | 07:39 |
| mcfrisk | Guest33: depends on how local.conf is generated. custom scripts, kas, bitbake-setup, templates with older releases. They all generate the local.conf. | 07:41 |
| mcfrisk | but the distro, machine, image recipes should dictate SW stack construction. local.conf should be only for build related features. | 07:43 |
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| LetoThe2nd | Guest33: there is primarily auto.conf which might be suitable. but it definitely needs a bit of care. for a component that offers two or three versions, and which do not have combinatorial restraints, adding versions is okay IMHO. if you have 5-10 SW packages and expect X versions per package, plus constraints, then it might not be the way and rather going for something that @mcfrisk mentioned. | 07:43 |
| LetoThe2nd | Guest33: the "DISTRO as small as possible" mindset, we've all been there, but the reality just is in my experience that "a customised DISTRO per product" works better. | 07:44 |
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| Guest33 | mcfrisk: For software packages that we build ourselves we are trying exactly what you mentioned. Meaning we are trying to program them in a way that they are as independent from other software packages as possible. Unfortunately that doesn't always work with external software packages (which lead to some of those problems, I mentioned). | 07:46 |
| mcfrisk | a family of products usually expects common interfaces and features, which a single DISTRO can provide, even across multiple different HW and thus BSP versions. Image recipes can easily cover minor HW and functional product variants. | 07:46 |
| LetoThe2nd | now that massively depends on what you mean by "family of products" and "minor variants". | 07:48 |
| mcfrisk | true, lots of devils in the details | 07:48 |
| LetoThe2nd | (which again, despite using same words, has often completely different meanings across teams, let alone companies) | 07:49 |
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| mcfrisk | also true. far too often I see little re-use between product/family/variant builds, and then everyone blaming that yocto is slow to work with. If I would build Debian based products by forking lots of source packages per product then I that would also be slow and painful to work with | 07:50 |
| Guest33 | LetoThe2nd: "the "DISTRO as small as possible" mindset, we've all been there, but the reality just is in my experience that "a customised DISTRO per product" works better." | 07:52 |
| Guest33 | That is valuable information since exactly that has already crossed my mind, but all the distro layers I found in the oe-layer-index seemed to try their best at achieving the "DISTRO as small as possible". | 07:52 |
| LetoThe2nd | Guest33: remember, those are the ones which are *externally provided*. which is a completely different challenge than "maintaining a known product" | 07:53 |
| LetoThe2nd | but again, it really depends on the types of products, variants, dependencies, and so on, and so on. | 07:54 |
| mcfrisk | I think it helps to work backwards from the actual product. check if a single flash image can work for all products and differences detected at runtime. if not, then what about different images but using same binaries for good reuse of sstate etc. if not that, then which SW components need to be build different, and which mechanism is used to trigger that (multiple recipes, distro, machine, local.conf | 07:56 |
| mcfrisk | changes) | 07:56 |
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| LetoThe2nd | mcfrisk: if we can add a virtual "without incurring enormous pain and cost" after each condition, then I think this is a good approach. | 08:00 |
| mcfrisk | LetoThe2nd: yes exactly. IMO too often some quite high level SW components end up requiring special per variant builds which ends up exploding the matrix and complexity. A missing soname, or devs just did not talk to their users about ABIs and changes to them. They need to be able to justify the decision and will not get things for free. Building 10 different distros and configs for 10 products is much | 08:06 |
| mcfrisk | more costly than 1 distro with 10 image variants. | 08:06 |
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| Guest33 | mcfrisk: > single machine/distro/build config variant, and multiple output images for different uses | 08:20 |
| Guest33 | > distro, machine, image recipes should dictate SW stack construction | 08:20 |
| Guest33 | I believe that is what we (partially already have) and are going for, meaning: | 08:20 |
| Guest33 | 1) I would like to have one distro layer that defines all software packages that can be used by our products (i.e. target images). | 08:20 |
| Guest33 | 2) One bsp layer that includes all our different machine configs | 08:20 |
| Guest33 | 3) Combine those two with what I call configuration sets (maybe that's what you would call config variant!?) i.e. one pair of bblayers.conf and local.conf per product/image | 08:20 |
| Guest33 | Within that setup, I believe, it should be possible to incorporate your and LetoThe2nd's suggestion of adding the PREFERRED_VERSION thingy per configuration set/config variant. | 08:20 |
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| Guest33 | > depends on how local.conf is generated. custom scripts, kas, bitbake-setup, templates with older releases. They all generate the local.conf. | 08:28 |
| Guest33 | and I think this comment from mcfrisk tells me that splitting the local.conf into a local.conf and a "preferred_version" part is possible by simply writting a small helper script that I will add to my custom init-env script. | 08:28 |
| Guest33 | sweet, thanks for your help and appreciate your insights very much! | 08:30 |
| Guest33 | Will try it out and see where the journey takes me from there :) | 08:30 |
| paulbarker | Guest33: Also look at bitbake configuration fragements (https://docs.yoctoproject.org/dev/ref-manual/fragments.html), may help you to split your configuration up into reusable pieces | 08:42 |
| Guest33 | paulbarker: thx for the tip. I don't see it within the scarthgap branch though (we are currently on scarthgap). Has that been added post-scarthgap or am I missing sth.? | 08:46 |
| paulbarker | Yeah, that was a added after scarthgap | 08:46 |
| Guest33 | ok, shame. I'll take it as a reference then and keep it in mind for any future jump to the next LTS :) | 08:49 |
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| rburton | RP: reminder to grab my python3-packaging upgrade :) | 13:18 |
| rburton | RP: trying to look at the glibc fails, turns out million-line text files are not great in browsers | 13:25 |
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| rburton | so far they're all the same install error i saw locally, that i had assumed was only exposed by shuffle | 13:27 |
| RP | rburton: like https://git.openembedded.org/openembedded-core/commit/?h=master-next&id=c213928b901e523eb13f95ae8e0986c271705358 ? :) | 13:28 |
| rburton | RP: ta | 13:29 |
| RP | rburton: there was at least one do_compile | 13:29 |
| smurray | RP: just a heads up, I'm sadly already in need of a Rust mixin for wrynose, so will be submitting one in the next few days | 13:31 |
| RP | smurray: fair enough | 13:31 |
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| rburton | RP: five | 13:44 |
| rburton | (exposed by god knows how many times the install failed so every builder had to rebuild glibc instead of using from sstate) | 13:44 |
| rburton | i've contacted the author of the patches i have that fix the install race | 13:44 |
| RP | rburton: five is at least one :) | 13:45 |
| rburton | ha yes | 13:45 |
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| rburton | RP: any objection to throwing just my glibc with the hopeful patch at a-full? | 13:59 |
| rburton | i have it pushed just need to press build | 13:59 |
| RP | rburton: go for it | 14:00 |
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| rburton | vmeson: next milestone: 32k! | 14:39 |
| vmeson | rburton: indeed. Context: bug number 16k: https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16384 | 14:42 |
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| sgavini | Hi, I'm looking into CVE-2026-5201 for the wrynose branch. At the moment, I don't see this CVE fix present in wrynose. | 15:18 |
| sgavini | I noticed the CVE-related patch discussion on Lore dated August 3, 2026, but I wasn't able to gather enough context from the thread: | 15:18 |
| sgavini | https://lore.kernel.org/openembedded-core/20260803041813.20-3-yoann.congal@smile.fr/ | 15:18 |
| sgavini | Could you please clarify whether the CVE-2026-5201 fix is planned to be merged into the wrynose branch? If so, is there an expected timeline for the merge? | 15:18 |
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| paulbarker | sgavini: I don't see any patch on the mailing list for CVE-2026-5201 on wrynose | 16:01 |
| paulbarker | I see it got merged for scarthgap, and master got a new version of gdk-pixbuf | 16:01 |
| paulbarker | sgavini: Could you send a patch for wrynose? | 16:01 |
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| rburton | RP: posted more glibc cleanup but the parallel thing is waiting on one more race fix (which i expect the AB won't actually see, but does exist) | 16:28 |
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| sgavini | paulbarer: I don't see a patch specifically for CVE-2026-5201, but I noticed that the CVE is referenced in this OE-Core patch https://lore.kernel.org/openembedded-core/20260803041813.20-3-yoann.congal@smile.fr/ | 16:33 |
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| rburton | tgamblin: curious what the timings are if you do ptest-runner in an interactive qemu. is one test massively slow, or is everything just slow? | 17:46 |
| tgamblin | rburton: that's how I've been doing them. See my comment on the libpng bug: https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16215#c15 | 17:47 |
| tgamblin | TL;DR: pngimage-full adds ~3 minutes to the run on qemuriscv64 | 17:48 |
| tgamblin | that's running on my Ryzen 9 workstation, no load other than background system processes and the QEMU process itself | 17:49 |
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| colin-pm | sgavini: I believe that discussion you linked is just new CVEs that have been detected, not CVEs that have are associated with a fix. | 18:05 |
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| sgavini | paulbarker: paulbarer: I don't see a patch specifically for CVE-2026-5201, but I noticed that the CVE is referenced in this OE-Core patch https://lore.kernel.org/openembedded-core/20260803041813.20-3-yoann.congal@smile.fr/ | 19:20 |
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| RP | AdrianF: https://autobuilder.yoctoproject.org/valkyrie/#/builders/35/builds/4485 :/ There were two others in my build too so it seems to happen quite regularly :/ | 21:27 |
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