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| LetoThe2nd | yo dudX | 07:56 |
|---|---|---|
| mckoan | good morning | 07:57 |
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| ernstp | sakoman: first, thanks for the great work with the stable branches! do you know when you plan to push "poky.conf: bump version for 4.0.14"? was just about to cut a release :-) | 08:21 |
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| rburton | khem armpit: can you fast-track the openbox/libcroco fix for meta-oe? it's broken in master since libcroco was deleted. | 10:09 |
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| JaMa | rburton: wasn't it already merged? | 11:19 |
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| RP | michaelo: should I just update yocto-docs nanbield to match master? | 11:54 |
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| rburton | JaMa: yes, my mistake. it merged after a metrics run failed | 12:00 |
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| Chocky | Is rust-native an integral part of the Yocto build, or is one of my dependencies pulling it in somehow? | 12:29 |
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| rburton | nothing is pulled in without a dependency | 12:35 |
| rburton | librsvg or python3-cryptography are rust users in core | 12:36 |
| Chocky | Likely suspects. Yeah, our setup has grown over the years; lots of excess items and recipes that could be broken up, etc. | 12:36 |
| rburton | librsvg is a dependency of gtk, so it's easy to get in builds | 12:37 |
| Chocky | Good point. We use GTK | 12:37 |
| rburton | you can't avoid rust then | 12:37 |
| rburton | central sstate for the win | 12:38 |
| RP | Chocky: I wish we could avoid rust, it is painful :( | 12:38 |
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| Chocky | That's me in the corner crying quietly. | 12:44 |
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| Chocky | Let's say I disabled libsvg in GTK and had GTK run directly to the framebuffer, do you think I could avoid it then? | 13:04 |
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| RP | Chocky: better would probably be a prebuild binaries recipe for rust | 13:06 |
| * RP has doubts about direct framebuffer making much difference | 13:06 | |
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| rburton | Chocky: you can't disable librsvg in gtk and gtk can't write to a framebuffer | 13:08 |
| rburton | gtk's icons are SVG, so it needs librsvg | 13:08 |
| rburton | if you use gtk you need librsvg so you need rust. luckily its native and not often rebuild. just use sstate. it's only a pain if you track master... | 13:09 |
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| Chocky | Second law of Yocto thermodynamics - gotta use rust | 13:09 |
| kanavin | sooner or later there will be a 'real driver' written in rust in the linux kernel | 13:12 |
| Chocky | http://irtfweb.ifa.hawaii.edu/SoftwareDocs/gtk20/gtk/gtk-framebuffer.html - GTK can in principle run against framebuffer, but it might be rusty (pun intended). The goal here is not really rust per se, but it's to reduce build time/complexity/security concerns. The Yocto build is well, very chubby. | 13:12 |
| kanavin | Chocky, this is the manual for the version of gtk that was current 20 years ago | 13:12 |
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| Chocky | right. And so it goes. | 13:13 |
| Chocky | Also the last time I used GTK before now. Go figure. | 13:13 |
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| rburton | Chocky: don't use a powerful UI toolkit if you don't want the size of a powerful UI toolkit | 13:14 |
| rburton | there are plenty of toolkits if you're limited in resources | 13:15 |
| Chocky | Well, I agree, but legacy choices, etc. The seriously considered alternative was running a browser with react, etc. | 13:15 |
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| kanavin | or rather, if you do use a powerful ui toolkit, use appropriate tools to have it built | 13:15 |
| Chocky | I'm aware of all the toolkits, etc, but I have to live with past decisions and see what can be done. There are wins elsewhere to be had. I can ask though. | 13:15 |
| kanavin | in this case a threadripper class machine or similar | 13:15 |
| Chocky | I'm not trying to start a philiosophical discussion about toolkits or whatever. I'm too old for that shit. I'm asking practical questions about what's possible to reduce size, tools, etc. So let's not get too worked up here. | 13:16 |
| kanavin | so then here's practical advice: get a proper build machine | 13:17 |
| kanavin | zen 4 threadrippers are out, get one | 13:17 |
| neverpanic | I know this discussion of "but rust takes so long to build, can we avoid it" from MacPorts (and specifically there, from people running old operating systems which Rust doesn't support and also don't get security updates anymore), and the effort required to maintain them isn't worth it. | 13:17 |
| rburton | if you can't drop gtk from your build then you'll be building rust-native 🤷‍♂️ | 13:18 |
| Chocky | kanavin: incredibly rude. You have no idea what I've seen working on | 13:18 |
| neverpanic | You could run an old version of librsvg that doesn't need rust, but those versions have open CVEs that will not be fixed. It's not a good choice. | 13:18 |
| neverpanic | Your best option is to accept that Rust is required, and work on reducing the impact of whatever concerns the presence of rust causes you. | 13:19 |
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| Chocky | rust doesn't concern me. It was a candidate for removal. That's all. There's other stuff. | 13:20 |
| neverpanic | Because of build time, or the size of the runtime library? Or disk space used by it during build? IOW: What's your specific concern, what's the variable you're trying to optimize? | 13:20 |
| Chocky | All of the above, and a lot more. I'm not just trying to solve this for me, I'm support multiple developers who are brand new to Linux or cross build systems. Even if I shave a few minutes off the build here and there, it adds up. There's stuff I've been working on that saves hours. It's a long discussion I'm not going into here. I'm asking, no more. | 13:22 |
| neverpanic | Good luck with that. | 13:23 |
| kanavin | Chocky, looks like proper sstate infra is really the way to go. | 13:23 |
| rburton | Chocky: 'all of the above and more' is quite vague. i agree with kanavin, the best win is to have a central sstate/hashserv that does overnight CI builds and shares the sstate to everyone else, if you're not already doing that | 13:25 |
| rburton | (for build time optimisation) | 13:25 |
| Chocky | Of course it's vague. If I have specific questions, I'll ask them. I'm not going to give you guys a lecture on the full ins and outs. I wasn't asking question about any of those other topics. | 13:26 |
| rburton | if you've not seen it, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9_bIKoqr5Y | 13:26 |
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| Max86 | Hello!, i'm currently building an image with initrd. I want to use blkid to list partitions etc. When i execute blkid i get a list with my partitions /dev/sdaX. When i try to format the list with "-o device" i get a empty list. Can anyone give me a hint? | 14:58 |
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| ad__ | how can i check generated rootfs on local machine in kirkstone ? | 15:12 |
| ad__ | looks like rootfs files are not visible | 15:12 |
| kanavin | ad__, build/tmp/work/target/image/version/rootfs/, substitute some of those according to your local config | 15:13 |
| ad__ | thanks ! | 15:14 |
| ad__ | quite strange | 15:17 |
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| ad__ | if i do bitbake -e xxx-image-dev | grep ^IMAGE_ROOTFS= | 15:17 |
| ad__ | i get the exact path | 15:17 |
| ad__ | but that path is not existing | 15:17 |
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| mckoan | ad__: do you have rm_work ? | 16:22 |
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