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| *** mckoan|away is now known as mckoan | 07:02 | |
| mckoan | good morning | 07:03 |
|---|---|---|
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| RP | JaMa: I feel bad for having projects I don't get to, rusty or otherwise! | 08:06 |
| LetoThe2nd | RP: isn't that just generic IT people? | 08:12 |
| RP | LetoThe2nd: probably but I have been making an effort to try and sort some of them as it was getting bad | 08:15 |
| JaMa | RP: I know, I have the same "disease" | 08:29 |
| JaMa | I partially envy people who can completely forget about the projects they were excited about just 2 weeks ago | 08:30 |
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| LetoThe2nd | In my case, usually a "side project" means "3-5 open browser tabs". They accumulate, and whenever I can't read the titles anymore, I need to "forget" about a few. | 08:42 |
| JaMa | since chrome introduced tab groups, I have grown my side tabs 10 times (with 1 letter group names) - before I dump them as bookmarks "for future" | 08:45 |
| JaMa | and using 4K 48" oled as a monitor helps with vertical space | 08:47 |
| LetoThe2nd | Technically correct, but I switch around quite a bit, so whatever is uncomfortable on a 14" laptop is not suitable for me. | 08:48 |
| * JaMa understands, but I'm uncomfortable with any laptop | 08:49 | |
| JaMa | so when I have to travel I take external keyboard, mouse and a TV :) | 08:49 |
| LetoThe2nd | hehe | 08:50 |
| LetoThe2nd | it depends (TM) | 08:50 |
| JaMa | I might be clumsy, but I hate when my thumb touches the touchpad while typing on keyboard, so I either have to disable touchpad (and use mouse) or use external keyboard+mouse (which I prefer, because of keylayout anyway) | 08:51 |
| LetoThe2nd | yeah same here, I usually have an Atreus keyboard. But still I often do stuff in cafes/restaurants/trains/on sofas quite a bit, so it has to at least "work" well enough with only the laptop. | 08:53 |
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| JaMa | yeah, I don't do life outside home (as unhealthy as it sounds and is) | 08:55 |
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| * RP has hundreds of browser tabs, another bad habit :/ | 09:49 | |
| paulg | slowly take out your RAM one stick at a time. Habit solved. | 09:51 |
| RP | paulg: I ended up buying a laptop with crazy memory :) | 10:03 |
| paulg | <oldguy> It makes me sad that now an old turd with 4GB can barely run a web browser. </oldguy> | 10:10 |
| paulg | in some long distant pre-git past, I'd made some kind of change to gnu diff to speed up "diff -u kernel-A kernel-B" | 10:15 |
| paulg | Linus was boasting on how he had 1GB RAM and so both kernel trees lived in RAM and hence he didn't suffer the I/O storm that mere mortals did... | 10:16 |
| paulg | A whole 1GB. | 10:16 |
| paulg | Public e-mail, but a lot of that 1990s stuff has "evaporated". In theory I still have it in a backup somewhere. | 10:18 |
| RP | paulg: it would have been very easy to lose matchbox and a load of other 2000s stuff too. It makes me sad things are relatively inefficient with memory but I ended up deciding usability of my day to day work was more helpful that the cost of some RAM :/ | 10:23 |
| paulg | yeah, I know fighting against bloat is largely hopeless. | 10:29 |
| paulg | But I'm still not happy about how rust/llvm/clang native in our builds now causes my older builders to OOM. | 10:30 |
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| * paulg still uses the bloat-o-meter | 10:34 | |
| paulg | https://www.spinics.net/lists/kernel/msg4338552.html | 10:34 |
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| marex | RP: sakoman: hi, this cpio fix https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-cpio/2017-07/msg00004.html has been shipping as part of meta-swupdate for like 5 years now, I tried pinging the CPIO upstream about it for a while and it seems the CPIO upstream is effectively dead ... would you be opposed to taking that fix into oe core and backport it to kirkstone/dunfell so everyone can benefit from it ? | 20:05 |
| marex | I am starting to run out of options what to do about that change, sigh | 20:06 |
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| JPEW | marex: Any ideas on how to handle files larger than 4GB? | 21:16 |
| sakoman | marex: you should submit it for the master branch, and if accepted I can backport | 21:16 |
| marex | sakoman: I mean, sure ... I would ideally get it into cpio proper, but that upstream seems to be dead | 21:18 |
| marex | sakoman: which, I said above, so I guess if you are OK with this kind of change and backporting it, all righty, I will opt for that | 21:18 |
| sakoman | marex: right, I meant oe-core master branch! | 21:18 |
| marex | JPEW: I am inclined to say, dont use CPIO ;/ | 21:18 |
| marex | sakoman: yes, I know | 21:19 |
| marex | JPEW: but then, if your update bundle is over 4 GiB in size ... what are you doing there ?! | 21:20 |
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| JPEW | marex: You'd be suprised | 21:20 |
| JPEW | marex: Does swupdate support anything other than cpio? | 21:21 |
| marex | JPEW: try me | 21:21 |
| JPEW | marex: Well, maybe not suprised per-se, but we will likely encounter the 4GB at some point | 21:21 |
| JPEW | 4GB limit | 21:21 |
| JPEW | Debug builds in particular are quite large | 21:22 |
| JPEW | debug symbols that is | 21:22 |
| marex | JPEW: looking into swupdate, no, I dont think it does support anything but CPIO | 21:22 |
| marex | JPEW: but then, I am also not overly involved with that part | 21:22 |
| marex | JPEW: re debug builds, yeah, good point ... but then, those are likely not shipping as update bundle, and if they are, can you debug with debugfs+gdbserver ? | 21:23 |
| JPEW | marex: Not yet | 21:23 |
| JPEW | Sorry, yes we can do that | 21:23 |
| marex | JPEW: I can also imagine someone can try and include massive container as part of the swu bundle in some streak of evil | 21:23 |
| JPEW | I thought you meant debuginfod | 21:23 |
| JPEW | The general problem we have with debug symbols is almost entirely a distribution probelm | 21:24 |
| JPEW | e.g. how do we find the symbols that correspond to some image | 21:24 |
| marex | sec, I need to read TFM on debuginfod | 21:25 |
| marex | JPEW: my solution to that is to always store both the image tarball and debugfs tarball, ship the image, and if debugging extract both the image+debugfs into the same dir and point gdb-multiarch into it | 21:25 |
| marex | with gdbserver running on target | 21:25 |
| JPEW | marex: Ya, for our public releases that's fine because those are a single point in time that gets archived in the salt mines (with debug symbols). It's the 100's - 1000 | 21:26 |
| JPEW | 's of other builds in the mean time :) | 21:26 |
| JPEW | Daily builds and such | 21:26 |
| marex | JPEW: hum, but those arent shipped via swupdate, so you probably dont have that problem ? | 21:28 |
| marex | JPEW: keep in mind, I am not too deep in swupdate | 21:29 |
| RP | marex: I guess that should be ok.... | 21:43 |
| marex | sakoman: patch is out | 21:43 |
| marex | RP: I am concerned, very much so, since it is patching such a core part of OE which has been basically unchanged for...forever | 21:43 |
| marex | RP: on the other hand, the change has been tested in meta-swupdate, so it should be OKish | 21:44 |
| RP | marex: as long as cpio doesn't have any interesting ideas about what negative size means... | 21:44 |
| marex | RP: I think by now, CPIO has no ideas anymore ... it is just ... stale | 21:44 |
| marex | CVEs go unfixed, releases do not appear since 2019 ... sigh | 21:45 |
| RP | marex: it is old school technology | 21:45 |
| RP | marex: finding people to maintain things is hard :( | 21:45 |
| marex | RP: and that, is only part of the problem ... finding GOOD maintainers is like trying to find unicorns | 21:46 |
| marex | sigh | 21:47 |
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| kergoth | Hmm are there any resources, tooling, or metadata to ease dealing with export control for yocto-based projects? | 22:11 |
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