Thursday, 2021-04-08

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LetoThe2ndyo dudX06:57
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erbomorning LetoThe2nd06:59
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qschulzmornin folks08:34
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LetoThe2ndby the way, everybody:
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qschulzis it live or recorded talks as it was for ELC/ELCE IIRC? Don't like the Zoom part of the conference :| except if Zoom is working ok directly from the browser? Don't know the current status of the tool09:40
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LetoThe2ndAFAIK it will be live via zoom (interactive) and youtube (non-interactive) again, but it is not yet set in stone.09:44
mckoanLetoThe2nd: is always difficult to find a subject really useful09:44
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LetoThe2ndmckoan: i don't really think so. sure, if the POV is "i want something cool for all the experienced ones who already were at the last 10 ypdds" then its rather hard. but i don't think that this is the majority of the audience.09:46
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qschulzLetoThe2nd: basically, my question is from the PoV of a speaker, do I need to use Zoom :p09:49
LetoThe2ndqschulz: "probably yes". but if you've got a good topic and are willing to prerecord to avoid, then i think that can be negotiated.09:51
LetoThe2ndi mean... YPS is not fosdem, we don't have to manage hundreds of speakers. i think we can care for personal needs and wishes on a case by case basis if it helps the overall event.09:56
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qschulzI'll try to find something to say. I probably will talk about the override (OVERRIDES, _append and all) mechanism from user perspective since it seems to be a recurring topic on #yocto and at my work09:57
qschulzand maybe the debugging techniques with Yocto but that took me almost 3h when I presented it in my company.... oopsies09:59
qschulzLetoThe2nd: basically, harass me until I prospose a talk :D10:00
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LetoThe2ndqschulz: i hereby define that you owe me a beer for each day until i see a submission by you!10:02
ndecqschulz: zoom works fine from the browser.10:04
qschulzLetoThe2nd: that's... brutal10:04
qschulzndec: 👍  thx10:05
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ndecand we are aware that zoom is not ideal, and we don't like it much neither... we are going to try to find an alternative.. but it's not like we have a lot of 'free' time to work on these things..10:06
LetoThe2ndqschulz: well you said "harass"!10:06
ndecthe reason why we've picked zoom so far, is that because it has worked well for the last 2 events..10:06
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qschulzndec: the LF was using proprietary SW for ELC/ELCE too, I would have expected them to figure this one out (e.g. Jitsi or similar) and do some load testing etc... I obviously don't expect YP to try this on their own ;)10:09
qschulzndec: anyway, I guess in a year or so it'll be history and nobody will care about finding a video conferencing SW since I guess most conferences will be in-person again10:10
LetoThe2ndi'm not soo convinced there.10:10
ndecqschulz: I would love to see an OSS video conf platform provided by LF.. ;)10:11
LetoThe2ndi have a secret plan for video conference world domination: now that MS is platinum member, we just have to get them to host YPS on teams.10:12
qschulzLetoThe2nd: I'm genuinely surprised they didn't use it for ELC/ELCE10:12
qschulzbut I guess they didn't want to start again the whole "Microsoft is buying the LF to destroy Linux/FOSS" narrative10:13
qschulzVERY wild guess :p10:13
LetoThe2ndjoke aside. my experience with teams is not perfect, but pretty good. i don't see it fit too well for a one-off thing, but more for ongoing training sessions. politics and narratives aside too, i like working on it.10:14
LetoThe2ndand once i get access to twitter spaces, i'll babble the s**tz out of it, hopefully :P10:17
ndecwell Teams works in the browser too :)10:21
prajvalshFor building an image for compute module 4, what should the MACHINE variable be in local.conf10:27
qschulzprajvalsh: are you sure it's already supported?10:28
LetoThe2ndprajvalsh: pick your poison:
qschulzprajvalsh: ok, it seems it is. raspberrypi4-64 should be used IIUC10:29
qschulzprajvalsh: c.f.
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prajvalshLetoThe2nd:qschulz:Thank you. I have built the image using MACHINE variable as raspberrypi4-64 using core-image-base. I have not been able to get the usb ports working on the cm4 after using ENABLE_DW2_HOST="1" in local.conf file. I am using the dunfell branch.10:43
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mckoanprajvalsh: what do you get running -> # dmesg | grep -i usb11:45
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prajvalshmckoan:I have to ssh to the device and see the message as I am not able to use the usb ports on cm4.11:59
qschulzprajvalsh: don't you have access to the console via, e.g. the microUSB port?12:01
qschulzor one of the exposed pins?12:01
qschulzwell, two of the exposed pins since you need at least RX/TX12:01
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tlwoernerone thing i think the project could really use, is to have more people who understand "the guts" of the system12:33
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tlwoernerfor YPS i'm hoping that some of the people who have worked on internals might be persuaded to give talks, or better yet, hands-on classes on "internals" things12:34
tlwoernermy preference is for live talks, and interaction. otherwise we're just curating a list of youtube videos. but in the end *content* is the most important thing12:35
tlwoernerso if we get good content from pre-recorded talks, then so be it :-)12:36
LetoThe2ndyeah thats what i mean. it shouldn't be the preference, but if somebody with a good proposal says "i can only do it prerecorded and am there for discussion", then i would go with that.12:37
tlwoernerthe best feedback we get is often from the hands-on classes, they have a lot of impact. getting someone to interact and actually do something during the conference really helps12:37
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tlwoerner(i.e. getting the audience to interact and do things during a presentation helps them understand things better, i think)12:38
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LetoThe2ndyeah. that should be certainly mandatory. if a (hypothetical) presenter is only up for throwing a video over the wall, then YT is a better place for it directly.12:39
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yateswhen yocto is building other tools, e.g., running a configure script, does it prebuild its own programs (e.g., bison)? if so, where in tmp are these kept?13:28
yatesi assume it does not use the host's install of such tools13:29
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qschulzyates: you add the tools needed at build time which run on the host to DEPENDS in their native variant (recipe name + "-native")13:39
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rfs613how can I debug a problem with gitsm fetcher?  I've tried bitbake -v -DD but it's not giving me any clues as to what is wrong. I presume it runs 'git', how can I get it to dump out the actual command?13:44
qschulzrfs613: ?13:45
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rfs613qschulz: yep, the "runfetchcmd" seems like a candidate to log. But my python-foo is weak...13:49
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rfs613qschulz: looking at definition of runfetchcmd() in poky/bitbake/lib/bb/fetch2/, it would seem that the 'cmd' already gets recorded by logger.debug() line 865. But I do not seem to see this in my output.13:56
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qschulzrfs613: I think it goes up to three D for debug level in bitbake? don't know honestly14:00
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rfs613qschulz: looks like I am becoming a python developer today... I think I've determined that it isn't calling runfetchcmd() at all. I added an earlier logger.debug(1, "test") and that showed up in the output.14:02
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rfs613so, this is strange... it seems to be calling Git.unpack(), which is failing, because it has not actually cloned yet. In the downloads/git2 folder, there is a reponame.git.lock file, but no actual repo. Likewise the clonedir location does not exist yet.14:41
rfs613i've tried doing bitbake -c do_fetch -b, this gives no error, but doesn't seem to download anything.14:42
qschulz-c do_fetch -f14:54
qschulzor -C do_fetch IIRC should be the same14:55
rfs613ok, that got it to do git clone of the repo. Now it's failing with similar error on the submodule repos.14:59
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paulbarkerHey folks, has anyone tried `bitbake-selftest` on master today?15:06
paulbarkerI'm getting an error in the npm fetcher tests15:06
paulbarker`test_npm_registry_alternate` tries to pull from which looks to be a parked domain rather than anything active15:07
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ecdheI was interested in using yocto to build myself just a compiler (gcc x86_64, no cross compiling.)  I thought about just getting poky set up, then adding a layer to override the default gcc SRC_URI, then bitbaking just the gcc-native recipe.  Is this a waste of time compared to just downloading bitbake and maybe trying to copy out the open-embedded gcc recipe?15:18
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rburtonJPEW: my diffoscope of a 300mb rootfs has been doing for the entire duration of the triage call15:25
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ecdheI was going to rebuild a debian kernel package on a not-debian machine.  So I don't need bitbake to actually build the kernel itself, the debian scripts will do that--except they depend on gcc and yacc and binutils etc -- I figured since there are already OE recipes for this stuff, it would be a good starting point, rather than me  manually putting together some wget-and-build scripts.15:26
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rburtonecdhe: why can't you just use the not-debian compilers15:27
ecdherburton: want a reproducible build so want the same exact gcc that debian is using15:27
rburtonbut you're building a yocto gcc not debian gcc15:28
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rburtonif you want to use the exact gcc that debian has, use a debian container15:30
ecdherburton: It's the recipe I'm after.  I can update the SRC_URI of the compiler to make that match.  I can update the SRC_URI for compiler dependencies such as libc as well.15:31
rburtonwhat about all the patches, and all the options15:31
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rburtoni just fail to see the point15:31
ecdherburton: patches == more SRC_URIs15:31
ecdherburton: the point is to build in a dissimilar environment for a verification of the output15:32
kergothecdhe: if you want to build something on debian from non-debian, why not just build it in docker or so?15:34
rburtonalso there is no gcc-native recipe15:34
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rburtoni dont' see what you gain by painfully writing a recipe to build debian's compiler/libc with all their options and patches15:34
rburtonyou could also just install dpkg on eg RHEL and rebuild the debian gcc package15:37
ecdhekergoth: the goal is a dissimilar environment to verify a reproducible build.  Same source to both dissimilar systems should produce the same output.  A single difference in the output represents a failure in configuration management of the build system.15:38
ecdherburton: thanks for pointing out that there's no gcc-native recipe.  I may just forget yocto and make my own bitbake recipe directly then.15:43
rburtonif you want the debian compiler then just reuse the debian compiler15:43
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ecdherburton, I'm looking to build the linnux kernel in a not-linux system+environment15:45
ecdhehence the need to build gcc15:45
ecdheJust looking to leverage existing recipes for that15:46
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rburtonfray seebs  RP and anyone else interested: pseudo patch on the list. comes with a test case!16:25
fraywhich list?16:26
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rburtonoe-core as instructed in the readme :)16:26
seebsyou can't just do things correctly16:27
seebsit confuses us16:27
rburtonright i'm outta here now16:27
seebsa vague thought: if i were gonna do an overhaul in pseudo, i think, at this point, the candidate would be "length-counted string implementation"16:28
seebsbecause we have so much strlen16:28
rburtonlets just rewrite it in rust16:28
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seebsi think in the mid term pseudo may be doomed because, e.g., Go programs don't use libc16:28
seebsand a thing that was going to intercept syscalls in some other way would have to look quite a bit different.16:29
RPseebs: FWIW I did look through this with rburton and I think it was a bug I introduced with the ignore path stuff16:29
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vdlIs beaglebone(-yocto) known to work with GPT?16:55
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argonautxhi, I want to debug the kernel with kgdb. But I cannot find the kernel with debug symbols within the yocto FS (No debugging symbols found in vmlinux-5.4.72-v7)17:18
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rfs613argonautx: the kernel is typically not included in the rootfs, because kernel has to get loaded into memory first before rootfs is mounted.17:27
rfs613try looking in your build directory for "vmlinux", you should find an kernel there with symbols.17:28
argonautxby FS I mean the filesystem behind the build directory, particulary unter build/tmp17:31
rfs613argonautx: yup, somewhere under there will be the directory where kernel got compiled. And in that directory should be vmlinux ELF format with symbols17:33
argonautxI tried it under build/tmp/work/raspberrypi3-poky-linux-gnueabi/linux-raspberrypi/1_5.4.72+git.../image/boot17:35
argonautxand all the other vmlinux* files which are ELF binaries17:36
argonautxI used the gdb from poky toolchain17:36
argonautx. /opt/poky/3.1.6/environment-setup-cortexa7t2hf-neon-vfpv4-poky-linux-gnueabi17:36
argonautx$GDB vmlinux-5.4.72-v717:36
argonautxI can load the kernel into gdb but non of them have debugging symbols17:37
rfs613seems reasonable, though I don't have experience with the rpi kernel myself.17:37
rfs613have you tried "file vmlinux-5.4.72-v7" to see what it says?17:38
JPEWrburton: Hmm17:38
argonautxsure find with -exec file to sort out the actual kernel binaries17:39
JPEWrburton: Ya, it's probably pretty intensive to diffoscope a rootfs image17:39
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JPEWrburton: Although, it might be a lot faster if we limit the depth to 1 or 2; I don't think there is any reason to have diffoscope recurse into archive formats inside the rootfs; those *should* all be found when we diffoscope the packages17:40
rfs613argonautx: it should say something like: vmlinux: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, ARM, EABI5 version 1 (SYSV), statically linked, not stripped17:40
JPEWvdl: I've only booted that SoC with MBR17:42
argonautxrfs613: correct and I found 3 places where I found a kernel with exact this description, there is no stripped kernel at all17:43
vdlJPEW: ok. I'll look into the SoC "raw" boot mode.17:45
JPEWvdl: OK. FWIW, I've never used that either; only MBR + FAT boot17:46
rfs613argonautx: do you have CONFIG_DEBUG_INFO enabled?17:46
argonautxrfs613 in local.conf? No.... Ahhhaa17:48
vdlJPEW: I know bbb can boot "raw" at offset 0x20000 and 0x60000 but I don't know if the (barebox or u-boot) MLO needs particular tweaks for that.17:48
rfs613argonautx: in your kernel config, yes17:48
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yatesi'm getting the following toaster error:
yatesis this a known problem?17:54
yatesis my python version (3.6.9) too old?17:54
argonautxrfs613: where is this file? there is a tmp/work-shared/raspberrypi3/kernel-source/arch/Kconfig but no .config17:56
rfs613argonautx: there will be a .config in the kernel build directory (same places as the vmlinux file) where you can check the setting17:57
rfs613argonautx: of course this is no the master copy, unfortunatley. IN yocto recipe you may specify a kernel config and possibly additional fragments that all get blended together.17:58
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yatesthis occurred after attempting to create a new project by importing from an existing command line project.18:02
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argonautxthere was only one .config in tmp/work/raspberrypi3-poky-linux-gnueabi/linux-raspberrypi/1_5.4.72+gitAUTOINC+5d52d9eea9_154de7bbd5-r0/linux-raspberrypi3-standard-build18:10
argonautxand it has CONFIG_DEBUG_INFO disabled18:11
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rfs613argonautx: okay, so the setting you need is off ;-)  Now .config is a generated file, so you get to track down how it has been generated, in your configuration18:14
argonautxwell I did bibake -c menuconfig virtual/kernel and switched it on18:15
rfs613oh cool, so hopefully that should toggle it in the .config file18:16
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argonautxrfs613: thank you18:53
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rfs613argonautx: welcome19:10
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marc1is there any reason core-image-tiny-initramfs does not list arm* in COMPATIBLE_HOST?21:08
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yatesi'm doing a "bitbake -c populate_sysroot example" with buildhistory enabled and get this:
yateswhat is the difference between glibc and libgcc21:52
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yateshow can i find the url's of the packages my recipe is fetching? i do not see them in the build history "packages"22:09
yates.. folder22:09
yatesand as my build errored out, there aren't any other folders22:10
yateswell, that's not true - there is buildhistory/metadata-revs file, but it does not contain urils22:11
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rfs613yates: so many questions :-)22:28
rfs613glibc is the runtime for C code - functions like read() write() printf()22:28
rfs613libgcc is an extra library provided by compiler to backfill some functions that not all CPUs have, such as 64-bit math routines (on 32-bit hardware)22:29
tlwoernersoft float22:29
moto-timorootbeer float22:30
rfs613yeah that too I guess22:30
rfs613moto-timo: with ice cream, I'll take two :)22:30
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yatesrfs613: ok, thanks.22:41
yateswhat about getting the fetched url's ?22:41
yatesallow me to provide my top-level issue: i am trying to build the toolchain for a new architecture (csky) and "bitbake -c populate_sysroot example" is crapping out in the libgcc do_configure. i'm trying to determine why22:42
yatesi mean, i know it's in the creation of some largefile-blah.h target, but exactly which libgcc is this, and how does it relate to the csky binutils or other foundational components for csky.22:44
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yatesand which Makefile is giving the error?22:55
rfs613dunno sorry....if nobody has done this yet for yocto, it may be a tough slog. Have you looked at crosstool-ng ?22:56
yateswhat is crosstool-ng? a irc channel? a project? a new rootbeer?22:56
yateslmgtfy: ...22:57
yatesoh yeah...22:57
yatesi actually used that some 5 years ago. it was horrible back then.22:58
yatesthere is a buildroot project for it, but i thought, if i want this to work under yocto i had to get the yocto toolchain version of it to build..23:02
rfs613buildroot has the option of using crosstool.23:06
rfs613Crosstool is for building a toolchain.23:06
rfs613Yocto and buildroot also do that, and use the toolchain to compile lots of other stuff, producing a root filesystem, kernel, bootloader, etc.23:07
yatesyes, but that gives you the binary. how would you "graft" that toolchain binary into yocto? i thought it needed to build it for the sdk23:07
rfs613don't know yocto well enough to answer... I was thinking more that you could look at crosstool-ng (if it supports you csky arch) and use that to build up yocto support.23:09
yatesyeah, not a bad idea. but i enjoy beating my head against the wall first.23:10
rfs613In other words use it for inspiration...23:10
yatestil i'm sufficiently bloody23:10
rfs613Oh with you're guaranteed some bashing when working in this area...23:10
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armpitvmeson, I got suricata 6 building with rust. code in master23:38

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